Just wondering if anyone knows more about this type of wrestling or anything related?

Anyone know how staged this is?? The blood is real Im 99% sure, but someone told me they use weedwhackers? Que el fuck? Ive heard stories of people getting shit cut off with those.

Watching some...I can't tell...they definatly look like it's preset what's going to happen but...they're hitting each other with fluroescent light tubes and ladders....

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I've been a huge pro wrestling fan since I've been able to walk, and I have a cousin who can make that same claim. He and I introduce each other to new shit from time to time, and he introduced me to CZW. It only took me about 5 minutes of watching the tape to figure out what CZW stands for- Dangerously Irresponsible Wrestling. CZW is what those in the wrestling world call "Garbage Wrestling."

There's no art or athleticism to it judging only from the tape I saw (plus clips on the interweb), just a bunch of wannabes hitting each other with glass tubes and taking bumps onto the roofs of automobiles from garage tops. It's only a step above backyard wrestling, hell, maybe a step below considerinng that 0.01% of backyard wrestlers actually have a shot at making the big time. CZW is exactly the type of non-athletic violence that turns real athletes off from participating in professional wrestling.

To be fair, however, I've heard that they might have integrated more athletic and artistic forms of wrestling into their shows in recent years. This could be significant considering I saw the tape around 1999, and it was probably a year or two old then.

In my opinion, wrestling is about putting on a show that will make the common man appreciate it, and the way to do that it to have contests that either A: look real (see William Regal, Kurt Angle, Bret Hart, Dynamite Kid, etc.) or, B: showcase great athleticism (see Rey Misterio, Shawn Michaels, Rob Van Dam, etc.)

If you really think rolling around in shards of glass and thumbtacks makes you a hardass, go brag about it to someone like Dave Finlay and then ask him for a tryout match. He'll make sure you appreciate the difference between how real men wrestle and how antisocial nerds starved for attention wrestle.

Even if you are turned on by fat losers slicing each other up and setting each other on fire, there are much more violent promotions to check out. FMW and the IWA Death Match Tournaments immediately spring to mind. I don't really like watching that, either, but they are even MORE violent and actually contain wrestlers that went on to greater success.

EDIT: I'd also like to point out that ALL blood in wrestling is real, with the rare exception of blood from the mouth, which can, on rare circumstances, be produced by a blood packet. All other forms of blood are induced either by- A: the wrestler cutting himself open with a razor blade to add his juice to the dramatics of the match, or B: a wrestler being wounded in such a way that he bleeds legitimately. It is common in the confines of a wrestling match for another wrestler to accidently (or, on occasion, intentionally) bust open another wrestler's nose, mouth, or eyebrow.

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I guess what I meant was...is it like underground...more actual fighting than an attempt at a show or something but I have been told I am wrong. And now I am sad. But Kimbo Slice makes me happy again! Go, big angry black man, go!

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never seen the particular org, but am familiar with the general kind of wrestling. im not really into it and the japanese were doing it 20 years ago anyway, most likely far better and more bloody.

IMO,the game already evolved into real submission fighting, which had been taboo in the states until recently....and for a time, even in japan.

pro wrestling existed because real fighting, real shoot wrestling and martial arts had no market, was too violent and distrusted as being a bloodsport spectacle for sadists and assholes.

so wrestling now is, to me, obsolete in a sense. i do respect it because i was a huge WWF fan whan i was a kid.

so yeah, real submission wrestling/fighting is more extreme because the submission holds can literally fuck up limbs and joints in a way unrepairable, whereas junkyard wrestling uses alot of superficial skin wounds like on the forehead where, the guys will bleed alot but the actual damage is not as bad. punches and kicks are real, are deliberate and will fully intend the internal damage they cause.

even the scripted throws and headdives into glass windows are decieving because there are ways to fall, ways to land headfirst that appear more deadly than they are. its all been done before as well.

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If your point is that MMA and shoot fighting offers a fun and competitive medium to pro wrestling, I'd agree. If your point is that more legitimate badasses are to be found in MMA and shoot fighting, I'd disagree, as evidenced by all the MMA and shooters who eventually move on to wrestling, not to mention countless college wrestlers, football players, martial artists of various sorts, and professional atheletes.

If your point is that MMA and shoot fighting are more dangerous than pro wrestling, I'd STRONGLY disagree, and offer up the point that more pro wrestlers are injured (and injured seriously) than are MMA and shoot fighters. Pro wrestlers have to go night after night. It doesn't matter if you know how to fall. Knowing how to fall 300 nights a year and having $1.50 will get you vertebrae fusion surgery and a cup of coffee in Massachusetts, to paraphrase a common saying.

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i used to be a big wrestling fan but have since switched to MMA. Pride FC, to be more exact.

CZW was (maybe still is) thrash. i gave up the WWE a long time ago and only followed Ring of Honor, which also became boring as hell after a while.

i might add, Chris, that nowadays you find far more professional athletes (mainly amateur wrestlers and olympic judokas) on MMA than wrestling.

you are correct to some extent, i remembering reading boxers sustain more head trauma than anyone due to the attrition of having to slug it out for so long with ,basically, pillows that protects against cuts but not the force itself projected. even kickboxers arent as bad because headkicks are swift KOs usually.

its like the difference between getting hit by a baseball bat a few times compared to being hit by a drumstick 5000 times.

but there are cases of serious side effects showing with some mma fighters, the sport is young and the first generation is starting to hit 40 and retire.

a thing not really considered here is for all the touring the pro wrestlers do, doing the same matches over and over, mma athletes train.

they have to spar, grapple and do some serious workouts overall that not suprisingly causes alot of injury because the nature of preparedness requires one to spar against a resisting opponent.

with any grappling art this a real concern because you want to train and stay sharp, but that means you train with folks who have to test your limitations, so the training has to be as real as possible.

the most common injuries are fingers, knees and ankles.....ankles being the worst because its the most delicate of joints that matter so much. most judo dojos bar ancklelocks because the right amount of torque, requiring not much strength can literally change the way the person can walk forever. you can handicap someone easily with a heel hook, alot of people are suseptible to leglocks because the difficulty in training thier defense due to the risk.


and ANOTHER thing not really considered is that since there is minimal padding<4 ounce gloves, that protect the striker, not the opponent>is the fact that shins,knuckles,elbows and knees are trained much like the traditional martial arts where the bones are calcified and reinforced by the healing of microscopic fractures<that occur constantly>causing the strikes to become even more powerful since the bone is harder and denser.

this is why seasoned kickboxers can kick refridgerators into modern abstract art pieces. being hit by one of those guys hurts.

kicks that can injure organs like the liver and kidneys in a way boxers simply cannot. kicks that can ruin a knee joint, break fingers if the opponent goes to catch the strike, kicks that can shatter an orbital.

so this si not so much an argument that mma athletes endure worst, its just its risky and in some cases can be.

i had an avatar of a japanese shoot wrestler gone MMA kazushi sakuraba. he was recently diagnosed with a skull/brain condition.

what happened was since he was around before concrete rules were set down between most orgs. he fought matches that included strikes to the back of the head in his earely career. and even in his prime getting hit there is dubious and not really altogether eliminated due to the nature of positions and transistions of grappling couple with the fact you can strike.

strikes to the back of the head simply happen, despite any rules.

basically what happened was he sustained so much damage in that area of the skull<a common tactic of his was to turtle up when faced with a homicidal barrage of attacks by a heavier,larger opponent> that the skull itself was calcifying and creating pressure in that area.


not good, to say the least.

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I agree wholeheartedly that MMA and other forms of shoot fighting can be very dangerous and that perhaps the verdict isn't completely in because of it's young nature. I also agree that those guys are legitimate athletes in every sense of the word.

I would also like to point out, though, that wrestlers still have to train their bodies outside the ring on top of long road trips, jet lag, cheap motel beds, unavoidable fast food restaurants, and wrestling night after night after night. A lot of people don't seem to appreciate how balls out the phony sport really is, and I'm glad to see that you have somewhat of an understanding that it is. Most people wouldn't even believe you if you offered up detailed statistics showing serious injuries in the fake sport that is pro wrestling versus any other individual real sport.

To conclude, I'd like to repeat a point offered up by Mick Foley, that is to say that wrestlers constantly wrestle through injuries that have any athlete in a real sport on the DL. If someone splits their head open during a basketball game, they will be taken out. If a football player breaks his arm during a game, he's immediately removed. If a UFC figher is knocked out, the fight is over. Wrestlers not only have to finish their matches anyway (which frequently results in more complications to their respective injuries), but quite often are also, out of necessity, forced to keep wrestling through their various injuries night after night after night.

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friend of mine who fights for the Mass destruction org came by today, i told him the bagel story coz he was the one to show me about setting up a hook like the one i did against the psycho.

he took the summer off to get away from the game for a bit after a couple victories.

hes going for the title shot for, i believe, 155 division, he told me today.

i dont know where im going with that, we were just talking about this stuff a few hours ago.

mma fighters train and fight thru injuries as well, the money calls and they make that decision. alot of competitors are from the 3rd world and the purse will go a long way at home.

i respect wrestling, but i believe its not as fun as it was with hogan, andre the giant, warrior, demolition, roddy piper and gang.

my favorite was george "the animal" steel, he used to eat turnbuckles and had a green tounge.

we grew up during a special time for the wwf and wcw, the 80s was surreal, early wrestlemanias were amazing, the characters, the intrigue, really carried the industry to a peak then.

MMA is just what wrestling would look like if it was real.

it just lost something nowadays, even those orgs that are nasty with the blood and shattered glass.

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Boxing became a lot more dangerous with the introduction of gloves, since your hands can't take the strain of pounding a skull repeatedly unless it has pillows over it, which allowed for said head-battering and the results low-tech cited. But what's most dangerous for the sport and what causes the most deaths is, I think, the way people starve themselves for weigh-ins

To be fair, a basketball player who split his head open would come back if he was able to that same game. Thousands of football players have played a full season on a broken leg, particularly running backs, whose job it is to have 350 pound men jump on their backs or into their legs. Boxers break their hands frequently in matches they continue and often win. MMA fighters will fight with unset bones and, like boxers, fight through new breaks if allowed. Every sport requires people to play through debilitating injuries of some sort, and while the fans of a given sport can only be expected to know the particulars of that one, that's no reason to assume they're exclusive to it. Wrestling does, however, get brownie points for having a never-ending 'season.'

I think the Necro Butcher is the greatest bar-fighting underground wrestler in the US.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=tlIRcTH56x8

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