Just heard about a school shooting in a ONE ROOM school house in an amish community. Im gonna try to find a link real quick. It was an elementary school I think. They said multiple people were killed, and three are in pediatric care in a local hospital. This is like ...the fourth one in a few weeks, fucking crazy.

EDIT- found a link- here

__________________

Was it committed by a musket? pWn3d.

That's unfourtunate.

__________________

An amish school shooting...... that just sounds unreal. But what the fuck man, ever sinece tha shooting Montreal, North American school systems have been getting attacked.

__________________

just because its in the news does not mean that its a rise in violence.

columbine occured at an actual low in school shootings in those years.

its like shark attack reports or the flu pandemic/plague/gods wrath upon us that gets major air time as a nice aside from the war in iraq, the bush admin or like, the latest celebrity scandal.

__________________

Well yeah, but look at the past few weeks. There were not a bunch fo school shootings following immediatley after Columbine. Are you saying that there are some school shootings that dont get reported?

__________________

"At least two ambulances had left the scene, and at least one person was taken on a stretcher to a medical helicopter."

Is that even allowed? haha I wonder if the parents or whoever was like.. hmm.... i dunno maybe we better take them by wagon back to the barn... we don't believe in medical technology.. or even automotive transportation. Hell we think its impossible to fly!

Sorry.. had to make some jokes about amish. Eh.. another shooting.. eh..

__________________

i heard the shooter made a fast escape on a donkey.

Yeah, I think they would be freaking out more than a regular community would. They really don't want to be on camera either. Satan help us all if the shooter was an amish kid who stumbled across a Cryptopsy CD a few days ago.

__________________

hahaha.

__________________

Better yet a Black Sabbath cd. hahaha

Even better a kiss album... oh no.. Satan compels you!

__________________

Oh man, this is fucking horrible. I just saw some officer on tv give a report. I feel like a dick now. The killer was a 34 year old. He went into the classroom, told all 15 boys to leave, the teacher to leave, and a few moms to leave. He then binded all the little girls up and shot them in the head. If there is a god I hope he is getting slapped around right now.

__________________

Man what a spree

man, that's fuckin insane. i mean, moms in the classroom? what kind of school is that?

Maybe school has just started and the parents brought them(moms).
Or it could have been a day where your moms come and help out like on career day or some shit

What goes clip clop clip clop *bang* clip clop clip clop?











An amish drive by.

__________________

career day on an Amish school? don't they all clean donkey shit for a living?

and churn butter

http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/10/02/am...ting/index.html

A little more information.

__________________

There are 6 dead including the shooter. He left a rambling suicide note at his home and called his wife from the scene. 3 little girls were shot in the head by the blackboard executionstyle. He was apparently getting revenge for something that happened 20 years ago. He lived near the school and chose it because there were girls that went there. One of the kids died in a cop's arms.

How very sad. I'm super curious about his motive since it was something that happened when he was 12 since I'd worked in child welfare. Time will tell.

__________________

I can't believe any of this. Where's the motive? That's what makes me go crazy trying to figure it out.

Ok, a little boy gets bullied to the breaking point and he comes back to school with a gun and kills the bullies, other students and teachers, and then (of course, the usualy ending) himself. That's a motive I can understand. IT's a stupid reason, but reasoning is not something the kid possessed at the moment. But a 34 year old truck driver just randomly goes to a one room school, and causes this? There has to be some reason, y'know? I know that the motive is sort of moot considering the dude killed himself, but it would satisfy my curiousity and several others.

I hate ranting, so I'm just going to say this is just one more reason why we all need more strict gun control so we don't give guns to the people who will use them in harmful manners.


heehee. Good one.

__________________

Dumbass, it's not the ones that have the registered guns you have to worry about. It's the rest that are not traceable by registery to the people that have shady pasts you have to worry about.

Sorry about the Dumbass, but it seemed fitting at the moment.

I'm curious if he was on anti-depressants or just recently got off them. I'm curious if he was someway abused at the younger age and something just triggered him to the point of acting this out. I wonder if he has any history of domestics or any other criminal record. Maybe he was on some weird drug and tripped. It sounds like parts of his mind were distorted as to where he even was.

__________________

this is rather fucked up. bass and jamf, i dont mean to be a bitch, but somethings are pretty fucked up to be joking about.

on the otherside, i probably myself would make a joke about this if i had enough beers.



still, pretty fuckin sad. children are innocent. i would not be suprised to see an exponential increase in school violence. fuck it, i'm moving to scandinvia

__________________

Well, then we need a new system. Or we (and this is unconstitutional) elminate the 2nd amendment and any laws allowing civilians to bare a gun of any form.

__________________

moe, stay away from Austria then. There was a girl kept hostage for 8 years there. I bet there's a lot of crap going on everywhere that never gets heard about.

Like the incidences of child abuse that weren't spoken of by the victims because they were too embarrassed or scared to say anything til recent years. A lot of countries overseas probably are still of that old school instead of knowing their innocence.

They've had some updates on Yahoo about the Amish school. He's had past law problems.

__________________

Actually i could seriously bust your balls on this one but i'll pass. There is PLENTY of fucked up things much worse than this that people joke about on a daily basis, and nobody gets their butt hurt about it. And besides myself included were making fun of the fact its AMISH, not the nature in which the murders take place.. So just like everybody else, don't get so defensive when somebody else makes a joke.

And 2.. you think that just cause you move to another country they don't do crazy shit? You've lost your mind.

__________________

This is a dumb idea too. he could have just as easily went in with a giant knife and done much worse. Or better YET. He have a gun illegally, and nobody have the ability to stop him even if there was a chance.

That was a bad argument for gun control to. Bans on guns doesn't stop violence with guns. Here is a good example. Ban on murdering doesn't stop murdering as with this, and just about every other case. thats pretty simple logic to me.

__________________

So few words to say the same as me about overseas.

Yeah, I guess I've gotten hardened from being on the net and reading people's comments. A couple years ago I'd have bitched about insensitivity, but I just ignore most of it now. I'm guilty of doing Amish jokes, too, but this isn't a time when I'd do them.

__________________

This is sad. Very sad. I haven't got anything to say. I'm completely confused about this event. I accept that it happened but its the WHY that my brain can't understand. Its like what happened in Russia a 2 years back, but that I understand better than this. They were children.

__________________

I'm just pitching ideas out there on the table.

Increase security at the schools. I know that sounds ridiculious to assign a cop or 2 to a school as small as this one, but wouldn't you feel safe if your kids were at a school occupied by trained policemen as opposed to anything less?

Good point about what you said in the second paragraph.

__________________

you could totally bust my balls. i am being a total hypocrite.


HOWEVER, this is still real fucked up.

i joke about sodomizing children probably more than the average bear....................but...........touche. JAMF, bass, dont think that was a criticism of you guys.

__________________

stupid americans

__________________

According to a report I read earlier a lot of the townships in Amish country don't have cops because the crime rate is so small. I'm really wondering if the state would have to press charges against him had he survived. I know of a single incidentof malicious mischief here that resulted in a baby's death and they wouldn't. I don't know if the state did or not. It was several years ago.

__________________

Btw i was trying to be too critical. But actuallya fter i posted i was thinking maybe better security at schools wouldn't be such a bad idea. I mean its kind of silly in a way to have a.. "closed" campus kind of hting.. Or if anything something along these lines.

Have a school where say there are only. Maybe.. 3 ways in, at each one a lil checkpoint where they check IDs. If you dont' have an id no biggie, go to office and get one blah blah blah. I dont' think the check points need to have a cop or anything of the sort, but i don't think its unrealistic to have better ACCOUNTABILITY at schools. (i think this incident is alot more odd than the general school shooting case). But high schools have a bad problem with accountability.. and for my children when i have them, i want accountability.

Students should be issued IDs and htey should be checked, i think its irrational to think otherwise, but thats me.


Another thing about other countries. i remember reading oh... it was i think 4 or 5 years ago in Germany some guy was on trial... for eating another human. Not just eating some person he killed but buy a person who WANTED to be eaten. I read this entire story about the case (this was whether to try him as first degree murder or something else). I found out there is an elaborate network out there ofr people who have "fetishes" for wanting to eat people.. and fetishes of people who WANT to be eaten. Isn't that fucking insane.

i'm not going to go into the details further about the story... but where i was going was.. yeah there are fucked up people EVERYWHERE.

__________________

I wish he had survived. I hate it when people kill themselves, or force the police to kill them, to escape facing what they've done. It cheats the whole system. The crime becomes the ulimate slap in the face to the victims who deserve justice.

I'm sure the Amish people could have dug a hole and thrown him in it for the rest of his life after dragging him down the road with a horse first. I would hope they have a since of justice.

__________________

i totally disagree. my highschool was like that, and IDs just became a big fuckin joke.

the problem isnt security in schools, it's the fucked up people. something is wrong with the general public. and really, what is an ID stand gonna do besides be a neusance?

__________________

That's pretty much against their beliefs that they don't judge, but God will. That was the logic behind when the baby died. Some kids were pelting a buggy with stones and one hit the infant and it died from the blow. The Amish family said the kids would have to live with that the rest of their lives and thought that justice enough.

I'm sorry, but I've been dragged by a horse before. It's not fun and it would have been suitable punsihment for the loonie. Especially if it was my kid. I think it's better when they die. We don't have to feed and house their asses for upteen years and risk them getting out however.

__________________

i blame MySpace, GTA and rappers.

Sorry to get off subject, but that German story you just described is what the Bloodbath song "Eaten" is based off of.

__________________

[QUOTE=Ten Ton Alien]i blame MySpace, GTA and rappers.[/QUOTE

Nah, I blame Perry Como and Neil Sedaka.

__________________

I blame bad fucking parents.

__________________

that was dumb to tmfreak...because we dont need a big knife, but illegal weapon....but you're right for the rest

__________________

hmm, the only reason this is more intriguing than any other school shooting is that the dude had some kind of other motive

__________________

after seeing those names, even i want to invade some school and start shooting.

i blame MTV, materialism, cellphones and pretty much all trivial advertisment to ever exist.

__________________

School ID's can be counterfeited and reproduced. Not the pictures of the student, of course, but the detail in the school ID (Logos, school name, etc.). Plus, if the guy who wants to shoot up a school goes to that school, I doubt checking his ID will stop him. Now, have a state-of-the-art metal detector and maybe an X-ray machine, although may be a little extreme, would be highly effective. In this day and age, Beaurocracy, however annoying it is, is the safest path.


Also, in reference to putting blame on something: I blame only two people (well, technically 3); the Parents/Guardians, and/or the person who did the crime. Video Games and any other Media are just scapegoats, reasons for people to escape their problems without actually having to deal with them. I'm sorry, but it is my opinion that a game or a rapper has very little influence over a person's decisions, and if they DID influence the person, it is because that person was too weak-minded and let them. In the case of this guy who we are talking about; he attacked this school because of a supposed traumatizing event in his life (we don't know what it is) that he chose to ignore and not deal with it properly, or his parents chose to not help him through it properly. We all make our choices, no one makes our choices for us.

__________________

Huh? you didn't make any sense. I was pointing out the fact that the weapon isn't the killer as much as the killer is hte killer. Regardless of weapon available if somebody wanted to do it they could. He could have just made a bomb and blown them up and it would be probably even worse.


And to Moe blunts. I agree the underlying factor in the case is fucked up people, and there is almost nothing you can do about fucked up people, except maybe have some sort of fascist crazy government were euthansia was going on, and only a certain type of people were allowed to exist. Although thats somewhat of a joke, its kind of true.

In defense of IDs, i can understand h owthat can happen, but thats less of a case AGAINST ids, as more of a case of shitty implemenation. When places get too complacent, policies fail and so do safety measures. I'm not going to spend as much time as it would probably need to argue that one out, but alot of things can be blamed on complacency. Hell the american school system as a WHOLE is way too complacent.

__________________

My high school had 4 security guards (only two of them really did their job right) and AT LEAST 2 armed policeman in the halls at all time. Having said that, they had to cover a 1600 person school. We had IDs too.

__________________

Well i understand what you mean, but its not supposed to "stop" the person more over, allow suffiecent before time for an officer or somebody with the authority TO stop the person. Thats just what i think. I understand the counterfeited thing but.. i mean i don't see a 35 year old random guy passing as a student at a school.

Not to mention its a case of just knowing who is and isn't on campus. I think its rediculous that anybody can walk around on a highschool or middle schools campus with hardly if at all any confrontation. I could right now walk into my old high school and just walk into any class.. And it wouldn't be a problem.

__________________

Well this situation is different. Amish kids are EXTREMLEY sheltered, and pascifistic. I would wager that lots of them didnt know what a modern gun looks like. And it was a one room school. These kids are taught to be quiet and obediant, a stragner walking in with two guns would have complete intimidation and power over them in a second.

__________________

Wow, we had 1400 kids. 1 officer, and no ids.
I'm not sure what the point of your posting was, other than to say what you have. (in otherwords whether you are for or against.) but the 2 who don't do their right, is another case in failing to implement policy as it should be. Nobody likes to be a tough ass when it comes to work, but eh... discipline is needed in certain work environments where peoples wellfare is at stake.

__________________

Oh i COMPLETELY agree ha. Thats why my entire arugment is a side tangent of this story. Its about modern schools and their issue with violence and guns. This situation is so completely out of the norm, a bunch of foreign people across the world are talking about it.. *cough* metaltabs *cough*.....

All i have to say about this kind of stuff... is makes you kind of realize how much people TRULY follow the laws and don't do insane things like this. As this is one person out of... 6 billion.. (yeah sure i know plenty of murder rapes and what not happen) You realize how dependant we are upon each and every person/ant to do their little part of staying civilized.

__________________

Best thing said so far.

I joke, however I obviously feel innocent deaths of little girls is obviously a terrible event.

Increased security doesn't stop everything. Ummmm......Iraq?

My high school had over 1200 students(grade 10-12) with a full time cop and full time security guards. There were still many race fights and people bringing weapons/drugs into the school.

Think about all the drugs being smuggled all over the world.

"Increased Security" will only invoke fear and bad things will still happen.

__________________

Then we need more than just security. I know this sounds ridiulous but I would have nothing against having a small garrison by a school.

__________________

Wow, somebody who actually agrees.

I'm sorry Bassb but thats a horrible example. Iraq. Besides the fact your comparing apples to oranges, when did there have INCREASED Security in Iraq? And when did this increased security lead to more violence? I mean you're seriously being just like everybody else who makes arguments against Iraq. You assume because the few incidents you hear about now and again about things that happen in Iraq that somehow its a complete mad house, and that violence is only increasing in Iraq. Thats a all too common belief.

And in response to your thing about your school. Same exact thing at my high school. One cop is obviously not enough, and rules are strict enough to prevent things. Its possible that there aren't enough FUNDS to fund having more cops in schools or other things such as.. check points, higher security things like cameras or detectors or whatever, but then again that doesn't say that my ideas or others don't work, its just they aren't being used or they're not being used properly.

Oh and i just reread your thing. About fear. Would you honeslty fear for your safety at school MORE from increased police or security? This is an opened question, as i'm not leading to anything i'm just curious if thats what you mean.

__________________

Man fuck that. I'm not living my life in fear of getting killed while trying to finish homework before class starts...what is this? America?

This shit is always going to happen.

What Canada is doing to the godamn Northwest Passage.

"In the 2006 election, Prime Minister Stephen Harper made a campaign promise to defend Canada's Arctic sovereignty. He promised to bolster Canada's presence in the waterway with the addition of three heavy-duty armed icebreakers. He also planned to set up a network of underwater sensors to listen for foreign vessels, and put aircraft and unmanned drones in the skies over the North. The total cost of the Arctic commitments made by the Conservatives is about $5.3 billion over five years."
http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/northwest-passage/

$5.3 BILLION.....

There are children dying of hunger, while the richer countries are arming themselves for total annihilation of one another. Everyone isn't a bad person.


Edit - I agree there should be security to some extent. BUT SHIT LIKE THIS WILL STILL GO ON. IT WILL NOT BE STOPPED.

__________________

I'm sure there is more to this story than just meets the eye.. haha But WTF for?#()&

Thats fucking extreme as shit, and here people are pissed off that congress passed money to build a wall protecting american borders. Thats fucking wild haha. What exactly are they looking for....?


edit: I AGREE WITH YOU BASSB AS I"M A BIG PESSIMIST. I DON"T BELIEVE THAT THESE PEOPLE WILL EVER BE STOPPED. COMPLACENCY IS NEEDED TOO MUCH FOR A NORMAL CIVILIZED LIFESTYLE WHERE WE DEPEND UPON OTHERS TO COEXIST. WHY ARE WE TYPING IN ALL CAPS?

__________________

Yes exactly, and they are boosting the Canadian/American boarder big time. I don't even like going to America now because you feel like you're a godamn criminal.

Canada is safe haven for terrorists...obviously.

Edit- And I really hate our PM, Stephen Harper..he's nothing more huge right wing, Bush puppet. I didn't vote for the fucker.

__________________

Well i would definately say they attempt to make you think that.. but eh, enjoy my country and i'm one hella proud american.

And ps. its cause your country sucks.

__________________

IT won't stop from happening, no. But we can stop IT from doing what IT intends to do.

__________________

I enjoy America as well, I've been countless times dude. But perhaps they should realize more of who their friends are/were, than to delve deep into what enemies they have?

I was really proud to be a canadian when we were known for our successful peace keeping missions throughout the world. However, the current PM is almost flipping that upside down and jumping on the terror bandwagon. I mean, Canada didn't even have anything to do with it until we jumped into Afghanistan.

__________________

as far as school shootings i believe, but have no proof, that the media networks had silently agreed not to run with school shooting stories a little after columbine due to the copy-cat/inspiration nature of people who are suicidal and homocidal getting thier 15 minutes.

if you remember columbine then you would recall that there were many school shootings before it and it was built up as this superduper, the walls are caving in, crisis of the youth, marylin manson was boycotted and all thiese 24/7 news networks were eating it up. i seriously think it just a media constructed freakout from the culmination of fearmongering, columbine sucks, but we didnt need those images stamped into our brains much like the WTC towers. school shootouts happen more fequently anyway and have been for decades. they certainly were happening after. columbine WASNT even the most bloody school shootout in US history, and it happened during a year that was low in these occurances.

i had this argument with my roomate so there his talking points.

i still havent read anything about this incident so i should of not said anything and should shut up now and check it out.

__________________

Or better yet, its more important to TRY and possibly succeed at least once than to never succeed ever. Does the cost outweigh the return? Hell yeah it does in my opinion. Sure.. nobody wants to feel "trapped" in their school, or not free. But at first it may seem like this but stricter enforcement of certain things would only help other than harm. I would imagine.

__________________

You make a very solid point LT.

Hmm i know what you mean bass. I hope you know i was kidding about the canada sucks thing, i've thought about moving to canada for a lil while but who knows if that will happen.

But anyways. I'm not sure what you mean by the friends and enemy things. And by peace keeping missions what exactly do you mean by that? (i know what a peace keeping mission is) but give an example.

__________________

I need a cigarette after all of this excitement.


But I mean, look at airport security.. What more do we need? I'm glad that " no bottled liquid" shit was removed. If security is boosted too much on something, it is going to deter a lot of people from going through with something they would normally want to do. I certainly do not want to feel like a prisoner when you should be enjoying things such as air travel.

Edit - Naw, Canada blows. lol.

http://www.lermuseum.org/ler/mh/194...anadasrole.html
As well as many other places including Bosnia and Haiti. I remember seeing Kosovo refugees playing soccer at a mility base here a few years ago.

Canada should be more supportive of Nato and the UN rather than of the US/UK...as should all countries.

We should help, not hurt. Perhaps beefed up security will not fix all problems.

__________________

haha. Yeah i'd like a beer myself, but i'm down to 6... to last me up till 2 weeks... So i need to get somebody to buy me some beer.

that on the other hand IS a good example of the downfalls increased security. Yeah that liquid thing was pretty gay. This just says that solutions to these situations is NOT easy by anymeans. or even plausable from state side. It kind of ties with the fact that we NEED to rely on people to "be decient human beings" in order to have air travel without.. obscene amounts of security. How to prevent islamic extremists is an ONGOING and ever more problem. Not just the US... dear god if anything i would say the pose one of hte LEAST threats in the US. there are other places that are FAR... FAR greater at risk than the us. Other sources of information would like you to believe otherwise.

__________________

I just heard on CNN that this was the third school shooting this week! Since August there has been 2 dozen!

__________________

Phew at least you said it.. now i can be honest. actually canada does suck.. haha
naw.........

Anyways. I wonder what the statistics say about the different shootings over the past like 10 years. I.E. motives, age, who was targeting and so on. That would make for some interesting analysis.

__________________

its wierd though. Except for the one in montreal, the recent ones were done by middle aged men with no obvious ties to the school. And all of them end up dying before the whole thing is over. Try to analyze that.

__________________

Exclusive interviews from the grave.

__________________

First thing, air travel sucks even without the security. It's like having your head pressed into itself.

Second, again, tightened security can be a pain, yeah. But it's like with air filters in your furnace. If you can afford everything, would you rather get the cheap ones that will let all the harmful particles into your home (and for someone like me who has allergies, it's no pic nic), or get the expensive ones that will revolutionize the quality of your air? I'd go with the latter if it were possible.

__________________

Thats why i'm saying maybe additional security isn't the best option. (security being your standard bullshit rules and increased people on the ground) Revolutionary ideas like.. hell they JUST allowed Marshall to start wearing civilian clothing. Fuck that alwawys helps.

__________________

n00Bz.

__________________

Air travel doesn't suck

__________________

mid-life crisis. you know, falling hair, depression at the work place, public school genocide... it happens to everyone.

See that was a fairly funny joke. Nobody go crying please....... please....

__________________

It is funny cause he is making fun of the bastard, not teh victims (amish jokes). Making fun of the badguy is usually acceptable all the time.

__________________

What are you taling about hes implying that with mid age crisis we will ALL go and have genocide of our own!!!

yeah i know. They have lost their right to not be an object of ridcule.

__________________

Does for me.

__________________

I think its cause they don't put you in first class and suck your dick i think thats what it is.

Fuck air travel!
Actually i'm joking about that, i REALLY like to fly. Hence why i'm going ot be a military pilot.

Ok i've posted way too much today.. Damn that amish murderer. Well at least he won't be able to do anybody else anymore harm than he has already done.

__________________

"America!, Fuck yeah!"

__________________

You know team america.. world police... Best movie EVER?

You know that one.

__________________

I flew on planes with no first class.

__________________

Damn... crazy ass story. Poor amish people. Why would dude target the amish? It was obvious he wanted to molest, but molest the amish? Maybe it was just an easy target the whole one classroom school thing. Fuckin sickos!

__________________

Well.... although the act is pretty dispicable i REALLY dislike Amish people. For the similar nature why i dislike "Native americans" who live on "native american land".

I'm not going to jump into this too much, but I don't see their point of views very well. And i'm not going to outspeak my knowledge about amish lifestyle. But i just don't like how my country has "seperate" countries inside of itself. I mean am I wrong to think that laws barely apply to native americans? I'm not so sure if its teh same way as the amish, and its probably not. But i think they need to grow up a lil. in my opinion.

__________________

I never actually read the thread until now. I just saw the title and remembered the joke.

__________________

i hope you're not talking about their beards. fuckers look like hobos.

I wish I could remember all the stuff a man from church talked about. He was raised pretty much in an Amish community even though he was a methodist. The beards, I think, have something to do with reaching a certain age or level in the church.
There's a lot of Amish in the south county here and from what I've heard from people down there they don't pay taxes the same as we do. They're exempt from road tax. I don't quite know how that works, but that's all I know.
If someone wanted to there has to be good research sites on the net about them.
It's very sad anyways. Sad anywhere.

__________________

This happened not too far away from my school at all.

What blows me away though, is how the family so readily forgave the guy and gave money to his family and everything. That type of forgiveness is just something I really can't even begin to fathom.

soo sad man....how do u stop stuff like this

__________________

Ummmmm if there was a simple solution then I don't think it would have happened in the first place. o.O It's not like you can just put more Fluoride in the water and BAM! Everyone has better teeth so every one smiles more and people don't have to be angry. It's just not like that. -_-

haha that was actually pretty funny, but you're right. Complex problems take complex solution. Never would a complex problem have a simple solution, as it would therefore be a simple problem. A little use of the word game, but it fits nicely.

__________________