I saw both of them collapse, live...

Unbelievable. This has to be the single most outrageous act of terrorism EVER.

I'll tell you my theories on the aftermath of this tragedy when it's appropriate. Silence in the rest of my post in respect for the victims and injured, and their families.

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Absolutely horrid. I too witnessed the second impact and the collapse of both Twin Towers of the World Trade center. My prayers are with the survivors and the familes of the victims of all the crashes, and I encourage everyone else to do the same.

i still cannot believe this happened... i cannot imagine how US anti-terror services could allow this...

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I don't know if they could have prevented this from happening.......how do u stop 2 jetliners from hitting buildings? No one suspected anything or had any hints that this was going to happen.....i'm still having a hard time believing it.....what pisses me off the most is the people in palestinia (whatever) that are laughing at what's happening.

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look, there were 18 minutes between these two planes... they could at least prevent the second one from crushing into the wtc tower... they KNEW FOR SURE what is gonna happen

concerning those ppl laughing... that's understandable, and i wouldn't take it too hard... these ppl live in another country, even in another world, and have another propaganda... mass media can fill your brain with whatever they want nowadays... in every coutry...

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the worst thing that can happen now is a nuclear attack of afghanistan or any other 'heart of terrorists' country by US...

don't blame me but i wouldn't surprise if these air crashes were planned by some US politicians and/or militaries merely to justify the nukes

damn, this world stinks... why ppl cannot live without killing each other

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nomadic one is right, as regards with propaganda, we deal with that shit every day living here.... and of course the people who died and the surviors are in my thoughts and prayers, i just heard about it when i got home, just over 2 hrs ago......

makes you relaise how lucky we all are....

buns

well once again we have become victims of human nature.
What will result from this is most likely going to be a war. And then, we'll all be fucked. (yes, a bit morbid). This is only the start of some serious shit.

peace

I'm sorry. I don't want to get into a knock-down, drag-out dispute over whether or not this atrocity was preventable, but how on earth could either of these planes be stopped once they were highjacked? Shoot them down over the largest metropolis in the entire US? I've been hearing the same excuses on the news, people trying to somehow blame someone else other than the perpetrators: "Security's too lax, someone knew about it, we should be more prepared, etc..." Obviously there are going to be policy reviews in all aspects of foreign travel and trade, but don't believe the hype, people. It's a known fact that there are those in this world with money, zealous beliefs, charisma, and highly trained and loyal flunkies; the combination of which makes them hard to exterminate and makes them a very dangerous threat (e.g Osama bin Laden). We have done virtually all we can to counter and prevent terroism and still keep an open economy and allow reasonable international travel, but my point is that with sufficient will and resources, terrorists can attack anywhere. The blame belongs in one place alone: those who planned, authorized, and carried out these terrible acts.

"They have awakened a sleeping giant, and filled him with a terrible resolve."

My sociology teacher tells me that Palestinians are dancing and laughing because you would too if you were in their place. this is to paraphrase what he said,

"how would you like it if you went home today, and realized that your next door neighbor said 'Hey i like your home, i think i'll take it' and did. and you go to your other next-door neighbor and tell him that your house is gone, and he says 'Good, i didn't like you anyway'. That's what position the Palestinians have been in. They were thrust from their homes (i think because of religion)And also, Israel gets ALOT of money from the U.S. A short while ago the U.S gave Israel a F-16 fighter jet. Guess who Israel is gonna use the F-16 on? Palestinians. That's why Palestinians are resentful to Americans and are laughing at the Americans"

By the way, most middle-eastern people think very lowly of Americans. One 'cause of religion, second 'cause they're a little jealous, and also they get tv programs like Jerry Springer over there, and that's buggers up the image of average Americans.

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I hate this fucking planet...

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The buzz was over the school in a matter of minutes, I shit you not. Some people had the tv on in the student center and all of sudden people are frenzied. It was pandemonium at my school. All 300 of us. This is most awful news. I just pray for those families and pray that there will be no retaliation. A couple of buddies were saying how they were going to nuke those suckers and I bit their fucking heads off. Keep in mind, they are my freinds. I just let all of them have it, and they shutup. I PRAY we have no nukes b/c there will be ww3 and everyone would be fucked! It would be like us and Germany and Russia against the muslims or palistinians. Crazy Stuff!! It was one of those fucking religious terrorist organizations. The Bosnian girl at my school was telling me about them. I just hope we go through no serious retaliation with them. Innocent lives have already been taken...there needs to be no more! You guys didn't even mention the Pentagon. That shit was taken half out as it is. Also a plane crashed outside of Pitsburgh,....... and the State Government building was hit. There is still one in the air I beleive. It happened at about 9:30 or 10:00 I beleive over here (in the morning). I swear to God, within a couple of hours, the news shot across to the west coast. It was like a shock wave! This is absolute madness! Just pray everyone that nothing serious happens after this tragic event.

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I know about the pentagon and i think it's awful just as well, it's just the WTC had so many people in and around it that are probably hurt or dead right now.

I know what your teacher meant atifman about their situation, but i still think it's sickening to laugh at so many injured lives. I can't imagine myself laughing at so much pain and suffering.....maybe if the buildings were empty, and they just destroyed it without casualties, then the laughing would be more understandable. But they destroyed so many lives, innocent lives that had nothing to do with what went on 1000's of miles away.
That's what makes me angry.

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well shit, do you know what pain and suffering the Palestinians are going through? It's somewhat similar to the Nuremburg Laws in Nazi Germany, Israel is pushing the palestinians around big time, they're treating them like crap. and they hate Americans because the U.S is giving Israel money.


I agree with wannabe (for the first time). I hope the US doesn't do a massive retaliation against who ever did this. actually, if it was Osama Bin Laden, i wouldn't mind, because he's a wacko. But if it's like a whole country or alot of people representing a large powerful group, they probably feel that the US deserves this treatment for some reason, and they're the ones retaliating. they're probably doing this to get attention and maybe start a negotation. if the US retaliated, this would most definitely turn into a war.


I'm middle-eastern and muslim, and this is my opinion on radical muslim fanatics: God i hate them so fucking much. They're not real muslims, they're fuckin' poser muslims. real muslims would never kill unless they're defending themself. "Oh, we're killing for Allah" - man, they are morons. if they were just terrorists, i wouldn't be so disgusted, but its that they add the "muslim" part that makes my blood boil.

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I still think I'm in shock actually.....but honestly, I've already come to tears and flipped out on things...

A state of confusion for the country, and likewise one for my mind.

This is truly terrible.....

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The Antichrist is opon us...

Prepare for World War III !

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I agree with Inverted....WW3 is probably on it's way very soon.

And for atifman, no matter how much pain someone is going through, or what they've suffered, if they laugh at another who's in pain or suffering, they're no better. I think the terrorists should have gone for another target instead of so many innocents. Pentagon i can understand.....but not the WTC where so many people go and do a honest's days work like any other person.

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yeah, if i were them, i would've just keyed up the cars in the parking lot. that would've made the point.

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There is no question about it! Every Country in the world is already deeply involved.

People have been talking about the end of the world for hundreds of years. It's what most of them live for. They preech about the how the Bible speaks of its forcoming. Day in and day out, they lie in wait for there trasition to the "After life.". Its what they live for and it's them that are going to make it happen!

The so called "Rightious Ones" the "Holy Poeple" the "Poeple of God"

Its these crazy mother fuckers that are making there dreams come true.

It is them that will make all this suffering. Not the "Devil."

FUCK RELIGION!

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i don't think we should really blame God.....just mainly the stupid corrupted religions of the world......mainly christianity, which is probably the biggest around the world, and the one with the most corruption and misleads and such.

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Blame the Muslims and the Jews!


They've always been buchering each other in the name of God!
And now there trying to bucher us too...

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even though i don't believe in god anymore, i still have my copy of the bible, being brought up in northen ireland, you have this shit drilled into you, a number of years ago, i studied Revelations, and would just like to say, sounds like the second seal has been opened - Revelations, 6 v 3-4, if you want to read it yourself....

bunny

I saw the direct parallel in George Bush's speech

"We will treat those who harboured these terrorists the same as the terrorist themselves" (sic)

That's him adding in a byline for blowing the Taliban sect to absolute hell if they ever go after Bin Laden.

There is no more shock in this heartless age, after the footage of the 767 into the building, after the constant news footage, after our initial shock, only anger. Deep, burning, savage anger. God knows who it's gonna hit. Australia will undoubtably be safe from any atrocities that could possibly be committed but that doesn't change the fact that people are going to die, major-league-style.

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The Jews are not trying to buTcher you too, you moron.

You live in a Jewish-sympathetic country, your country provides aid, arms and intelligence services to Israel and the Palestinians hate your guts for it.

You stupid comment is the sort of alarmist bullshit that makes my Lebanese friends in the US afraid to be Lebanese because they think people are gonna fuck with them for simply looking vaguely Arabic. Try thinking before you type this sort of shite.

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I think this is the start of something big, and lots of people will suffer from it all.
Sane, you're kind of lucky being in australia, cause i don't think they'll get involved really. But others in north america (like myself and many others in this forum) will probably be faced with a lot of crap because of what happened yesterday.

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THOSE EVENTS SHOWS US HOW LOW AND RIDICULOUS HUMAN BEEING IS.... AT FIRST I FELT VERY CONCERNED BY THIS... OF COURSE THIS IS TERRIBLE MANY PEOPLES DIED (SORRY FOR THE ONES WHO HAVE KNOWN PEOPLES WHO DIED) BUT THIS JUST GONNA MAKE PEOPLES REALIZE HOW STUPID WE ARE AND THAT EVERYTHING CAN HAPPEN ANYTIME ANYWHERE.
EVEN A ALIEN INVASION WOULDN'T SURPRISE ME
SINCE YESTERDAY THE WORLD HAVE CHANGE VERY MUCH AND DON'T WORRY IT IS FOR IS OWN GOOD...WE HAVE REACH THE BOTTOM OF THE PIT AND THE ONLY THING LEFT TO DO IS TO GET OUT TOGETHER (EVERYBODY!!!!!!, BLACK OR WHITE GAY OR LESBIAN, BUDDHISM OR CATHOLIC, ALL DRESSED OR PLAIN I DONT GIVE A SHIT WE HAVE TO LIVE TOGETHER ... ITS GONNA BE VERY LONG THIS IS ONLY THE BEGINNING.

SOMEONE DID A BIG MISTAKE BY KILLING THOSE INNOCENT (AND I HOPE HE OR THEY WILL BE TORTURED SLOWLY....
VERY S-L-O-W-L-Y) ..... BUT THIS HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH JEWS, PALESTINIANS, RACES OR RELIGIONS.... THIS IS HUMAN BEEING FAULT

FROM NOW ON RAMBO ISN'T THAT VIOLENT FOR
A 5 YEARS OLD KID

SLAYER NEW ALBUM FUCKIN ROCK

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Blame it on religion. We all know that there is no such thing as god ,religion is the cause of all this shit.

On the Palestina laughing people: I think the majority of the Palestina people is as shocked as most of us. Those laughing on those streets were just dumbfucks with too much time on their hands. The media filmed them because they knew Americans would be shocked by seeing it.

A war? I hope NOT. Let's face it: estimated victims could be around 60.000... That's an AWFULL lot. There have been wars fought over far minor conflicts. BUT they still don't know who's responsable for the terrorism acts.
It's both brilliant and stupid at once.
Brilliant: exceptional damage has been done in the heart of America with minimal loss of own military and no clues at who has done it.
Stupid: In order for the brilliance to remain , the executing power must remain anynomous and doing so the world will maybe never know WHY they did it or what ideology they want to promote.

I'm sure Bush,the FBI and the rest are experiencing severe pressure right now. They just HAVE to find out who did this. The public won't accept no shit this time. This means that if they continue having no clues they may well just look for the guys who are most probably implicated in this and leave the real authors enjoying from their victory.

what's really pissing me off is that stupid-ass white guys are beating up anybody in schools that looks remotely middle-eastern. i heard that a couple of kids got beat up yesterday and today, and they didn't have anything to do with anything. look at it this way, if Vietnam was suspected of this heinous act, those stupid-ass white guys would go around beating people up that are oriental. it's so retarded. I wouldn't be as outraged if they were beating up Palestinians or Afghanis (i'd still be mad 'cause they don't deserve it), but they're just beating up people that are middle-eastern, it's appalling how ignorant people are.


and they're probably will be a war over this. most fingers are pointing to Osama bin Laden, who's hiding out in Afghanistan. like sane said from Bush's speech:
"We will treat those who harboured these terrorists the same as the terrorist themselves" (sic)
they're gonna attack Afghanistan (if you didn't know by they way, Afghanistan is sanctioning bin Laden, and a bunch of people support bin Laden and his ideals) or at least piss them off. and guess who's friends with Afghanistan. Russia. it's gonna have a ripple effect and more and more countries are gonna get involved, turning this into a World War.

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Look, first off I'm not a racist and I dont hate anybody. My coworkers are mosty Afghans and Jews and they all share the same opinion as me. Why? Becase they live in the U.S.A! They realize the religious bullshit thats going on in there homelands and they came here as refugies.

Only "Ignorance" would cease to realize whats going on here. We got fucked because we took side with the Jews. We are trying to get involsd with there mess and now we're paying the price.

This is a War between the Palestinians and the Jews. And its a War between the tecnical deferances of there religion. The U.S slould of minded its own business.

Mabey now you'll realize what I was trying to say?

Sorry if I may have offended anyone. I just speak my mind, just like Atifman making referances towrd "Stupid ass white guys".

I'm white and I dont care because he's right!

Peace!

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If this ever came to world war (which I think has about a .0000001% chance), it would be the most lop-sided world war in history. The astounding majority of the international community is on our side, for obvious reasons.

And another thing. All this talk about how mankind is rotten and it's humanity's fault is bullshit. No one talks like that until something bad happens. By and large, mankind is benevolent. You can give me all the examples of people being rotten to each other you want, and I won't deny that some people choose an evil path, but for every one of those, I can give you ten times as many cases of people helping and caring for each other. For instance, a relatively small number of people caused the violence and destruction in NY, DC, and PA. But look at how those respective communities rallied to search for survivors, give blood, and volunteer in countless other ways to help the survivors and victims' families.

I agree with Atifman....stupid ass whilte guys shouldn't be going around beating people up for being middle-easterners or anything, they weren't the ones who went and killed everyone...all they do is live their lives just like the white boys, they just come from a different place, and because of their race, the white boys accuse them.
I'm white.....and i live in canada, and even though it didn't happen over here, apparently there's already people having fights with arabs and other races because of this, and those in arab and palestinian embassies around here are fearing for their lives. It's gonna be fools like those white boys who just want fucking revenge and death to those people.....i think they could probably all settle this around a discussion table, if they at least tried, without going into war. But, with the world today, that's not gonna happen.

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Ehud Barak's answer to the problem of retribution was simple - "We take the US, the UK, Russia and the EU and we find these people and fucking flatten them!" (I'm paraphrasing of course)

(Barak isn't exactly wetting himself because the chances are any retribution involves a lot of dead Islamic people, and a massive tidal wave of anti-Arab sentiment from around the worl, in democratic countries where the populous was previously REASONABLY neutral. Arabic hate-crime has already started perpetrated by those Americans who think that painting over signs written in Arabic outside language schools will deter terrorists)

Even in Brisbane on Australia's Sunshine Coast, up north where Modo lives, people are throwing bottles at and breaking windows in school buses of Islamic children. Some people are just cunts, everywhere.

...And just a tail-ender:
Like I said before, it was reported today that the Taliban were now in line for a severe fucking-up if this is the work of Bin Laden and they don't extradite him, and that was the most considered line of Bush's initial address. f_b_s, ahead of that papers as per usual (how's that arrogance now Modo?)

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OK! There is not going to be a world war three, so you fuckers just shut your yappers! Are you actually trying to to cuase more chaos. And enough of the devil worshipers here "blaming it on God". Ignorant people please shut up now! It is not a war between the religions per say...it's the land base issue. Ever since WW2, we have been in the middle east. After that, the jews were sent to Israel for freedom from religious and racial persecution from Hitler (dirty fucker!). The Palestinians didn't like that at all. They have been wanting that land back ever since then, guys. Since we have distributed money in this area and supported the jews here, we haven't been praised too much by the Palistinians. That group was a religious extremist terrorist organization. Just like the Christian extremists who blow up buildings for "the name of God". Horseshite if I may add. It's bullshit. They are just crazy fuckers! Their religious leaders don't support this at all!

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Religous extremists are the same everywhere, all that changes what they do is the way they're socialised. Like the american lifer group that says "If you're not in jail for trying to stop abortions, then you should be killed." That's where that dude who killed the abortion doctors came from. Same loonies, different smell.

I was talking with Rob about this earlier. WW3 is not an option. War: maybe (dependent on definition), world war: no chance.

Another good point - this has nothing to do with mainstream Islam. But I hoped people would have assumed that.

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Sorry bro, But the truth hurts. Its going to be the poeple that are stuck off in La La Land the are gonna suffer the most .

All I'm trying to say is be prepared and don't get cought off guard!

I didn't mean to strike fear into your heart.

So calm down. Just prepare for the worst...

Or just kill yourself right now. Your be one less motherfucker to kill. (JUST KIDDING! THATS SOME LYRIC FROM A OLD S.F.U. SONG!

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hey man it realy sux if we do go to war but hey im on americas side (i a'nt stupid) i say.....

NUKE AFGANISTAN

i only hope those who has the power to start this shit is NOT AS STUPID as you are

why some ppl think that killing other innocents can help those who are dead, or prove something????!!!!

good point nomadic one.......now if only people can learn that....

Yeah, thanku. If you want to nuke, there will be WW3. WE dont want that! Besides, everyone is pissed at the muslims anywho. It would be everyone against them. But we don't need anymore casualty.

Inverted...there will be no war. That's an obsurd exageration. Unfortunately, I'm afraid something will be done in retaliation. Otherwise, how would that make us look, ya know? Hopefully we will identify the people eho harboured these imbeciles and take care of them and that be it. Cuase those assnuts are still out there. It was huge mastermind and there's more, rest assure.

Peace it......

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Hmmmmmmm. This is all very exciting. What worries me most is that everyone was making jokes about how dumb George W is, and now he's the guy with ghis finger on the button. I can't help but feel that we're all screwed. NAh, I don't think this is the end of the world. THis is just the beginning.
Oh yeah, I agree with Power Groove. The majority of the human race is benevolent rather than malevolent. It's only when ppl join in masses that everyone seems to go nuts.
I'm just glad I live in the best country in the world.

FUCKING A FUCKING A FUCKING A

...All we have to fear is poor people in boats

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Yeah but at least we won't be overtaken by a group of intellectually superior marsupials

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I were too lazy to read the whole thread, so sorry if I say something, what others also did.

- There wouldn't be a third world war, for two reasons - Afganistan did "surrender". Afganistan hasn't got any allied countries, soo... basicly America won't do anything with that place.

- That 30,000 death rate is used for a commercial, so the mercurial TVs are used that number to get money.

- If I could wish something, I'd wish, that those fuckheads would been died, who were celebrating innocent's death, not those, who were working, and been proper citizen.

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Sodom Insane from Iraq threatends to retaliate if U.S attacks Afgahnistam!

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Shit, he did? Bah. And pah.

Unless he wants another Gulf Way his supposed retaliation will be entirely nodescript. A pure propaganda statement.

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hussien should shut his fucking pussy lips dude,he will get fucked if he even trys to make a move on the us....again.

yeah, well you really taught him last time didn't "you"?

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Morning news said, that Afganistan denied to hand over Osama to the US, and they started the negotiation with they adjoining countries, to give rise to a union.

Scary, huh?

So there might be a World War III...

Fuck...

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dude i hope not they say the next world war will last half an hour (the time it will take for the nukes to hit) then the hole world will be doomed

I'm for any type of retaliation as long it does hurt innocent people.

and is anybody as pissed as off as I am about TV covering this tragedy 24/7? yeah i do care about the tragedy, but there's so much of the stuff i can watch with out getting bored. and they say the same stuff over and over every 10 minutes. and they have it on like every channel. they should only have it on like a couple channels.

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I've got a lot to say, but right now my comp's continuously blinking out on me(it's why I couldnt post earlier), so I'll try to keep this brief.

World War 3: Um, how? America's maybe the only remaining super power, and we can basically count on just about every other near super power to support us. Afghanastan's a country that has to fight with itself to exist each day, and it can only rely on other Muslim fundamentalist countries, which, thankfully, are few in number and in power. Now, we are gonna have a pain in the ass going through Afghanastan to find and obviously fairly elusive and genius bin Ladin without much or any government help, but if there's gonna be a country to make a stand against us, it wont be Afghanastan. The only neighbouring country I know of that would help them is Iran, incidentally where Muslim fundamentalism started in resentment of U.S. rule(yeah, people in the Middle East hate us for many reasons, not just Israel, check your history books people), seeing as Pakistan, the only other fairly radical Muslim government neighbouring Afghanastan, has already agreed to help us. So, in short, World War 3 isnt likely.

Arab hate crimes: Retarded. That's about all I think has to be said. Any moron who cant tell the difference between an every-day Muslim and a Muslim fundamentalist maybe shouldnt be free to go around beating people. Plus, if you really wanna kill Arabs so badly, why dont you just join the Army? I'm sure we'll be in there soon. Course, most of these dudes'd be a little to scared to fight when there's a chance of getting hit back.

Nuking Afghanastan: The only sure-fire way to turn all the world opinion we have in our favour now AGAINST us, so probably a stupid option.

Osama bin Ladin: Obviously a wasted genius. Man, this guy is so diabolically clever it's almost scarier than what he's done. I mean, look at what he's done in the past year: Dissapeared from US and Israeli intelligence, orchestrated and planned out a mind-boggling attack, assasinated the head of opposition to the Taliban right before America would need him the most, and probably planned his response to our retaliation already. The guy's smart, plus he has CIA training and the most diehard resolve imaginable. Really, really fucking scary.

TV coverage: atifman, I agree. America has to learn to go back to our regular lives, and that includes programming and all. I dont think everyone needs to see the towers collapse and footage of bin Ladin every five to ten minutes.

Anyway, I just wanna say I disagree with, and am sorta sick of, people who think we shouldnt retaliate for this. Especially those who say it'll start World War III, even if they're just quoting Nostradamus. If we dont retaliate, we'll get riskier attacks, and retaliating wont get any more attacks on us than there already is. People may not know this, but we're constantly under attack by things with the potential of being this tragedy; they just usually catch them. The only good argument to non-retaliation is that we'll inevitably kill innocent Afghan's, which is wrong, but unfortunately a necessary part of war. But, to review: retaliating will not get us under more attack, cause we're already under a fair amount that just luckily get's stopped, and WWIII wont be happening unless Afghanastan suddenly gets NATO, most of Europe, Israel, Australia, and even Russia on THEIR side, which might happen if we act retarded and drop the A-bomb.

Also, I just put in Australia to point out that Australia's mutual defense agreement with us puts them in this too, so Jim might not be as lucky as he thinks.

Plus, apparantly I went on longer than I planned to, I guess I'm not blinking out. And anyone who wants me to explain any references I made to US's pissing off of the middle east or thwarted terrorist attacks on this country, just post and ask.

FYI everyone: That email thing about Nostradamus' prediction was a hoax. If you noticed how shitty the grammar, spelling, and punctuation was, you're probably not surprised.

I understand your point but today's wars aren't won based on the number of soldiers you can send.
It is a poor country but I understand that they're not so easily beaten as you might think. I believe Russia got their asses kicked a bunch of years ago.
Also : if they got nothing ,that makes them even more dangerous and hard to fight. If you got nothing ,you got nothing to lose.
I understand that even Afghanistan has its own set of nukes.

one word of warning.....don't listen to everything you hear on the news....the media has a great history of being involved in mass propaganda, and most people like sheepie that we are, take it all in....and believe every single word of it....but hey that's not just my thoughts about the media...it's what i've grown up with....and the media in one country is the same as in any other country....
soul-sucking, pieces of shit...(imho)

bunny

This has nothing to do with the topic, but could you not write in that font, bunny? It's really hell on the eyes.

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font changed....and what you mean it has nothing to do with the topic?? it has EVERYTHING 2 do with it...imho

bunny

*laughs*
You say IMHO a lot...

I wasn't meaning that your post had nothing to do with it, I was talking about the post I'd made about the font color.

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you did?? ah well....must have been the way you worded it or something....anyway i'm heading to bed...being up for 16hrs really fucks your head up......nite nite.....

bunsxxx

what the hell does IMHO mean anyways???

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In My Honest (or possibly Humble) Opinion.

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In response to that thing about Afghanastan, way back before we had the great font argument, I have to say this:

Firstly, I wasnt aware Afghanastan had nukes, but I have little reason to believe they dont any more than to believe that they do.

Secondly, Russia had trouble in Afghanastan because it attacked there during the Cold War, when a little organization known as the CIA had to respond to everything Russia did, and decided it would be a good idea to train Muslim fundamentalists to fight the Russians. Little did we know that these same people we gave training to would soon make up the majority of bin Ladin's terrorist organization, including Osama himself.

Thirdly, Afghanastan could be easier than it seems for the reason that they're in the middle of a civil war. If we go in on a very focused, specific mission, not taking sides in the war as we did when we made a mistake in Southeast Asia, I think the Taliban would have some trouble fighting of both the now somewhat disorganized rebellious factors(they were going fairly strong, until two assasins posing as reporters carried a bomb right into the same room as the unifying part of this coallition, not to mention it's resident military genius, strangely enough a mere two days before the planes hit the WTC towers) and a military which has a fairly good track record, at home and on the road, especially when it feels strongly about something. And especially when all the surrounding countries are either sympathetic but with closed boarders or against them. Course, I might be proven wrong and have to eat my words.

But I still think that they need to be unified with one large country that can really make a good stand for it to go to a world war like people seem to think, and I, at this moment and admittedly not a genius on foreign politics, dont really see that happening.

Oh, and the nostradomus thing, a friend of mine knew that quote from before, he didnt see it online. But the date they have online's ridiculous, I'm pretty sure he was dead when he's claimed to have said that.

And I have nothing to say about media progaganda because I very little about it.

PST 88 you're to politicaly correct. Are you sure you did'nt go to Standford or somthing?

You sould write a documentry on Bin Laden.

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IMHO - In My Humble Opinion

The US funded and trained the Mujihadeen to take over Afghanistan, and the Taliban to take over from the Mujihadeen. Kinky eh?

that Nostradamus prophecy is totally false. not only was he dead for 40 years in the year he was quoted but the whole prophecy is totally bullshit. check out www.snopes.com to see the riddle busted like the bitch it is.

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Got this in my mail...thought you may be interested in seeing it...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

The date of the attack: 9/11 - 9 + 1 + 1 = 11

September 11th is the 254th day of the year: 2 + 5 + 4 = 11

After September 11th there are 111 days left to the end of the
year.

119 is the area code to Iraq/Iran. 1 + 1 + 9 = 11

Twin Towers - standing side by side, looks like the number 11.

The first plane to hit the towers was Flight 11.

I have MORE...

State of New York - The 11 State added to the Union

New York City - 11 Letters

Afghanistan - 11 Letters

The Pentagon - 11 Letters

Ramzi Yousef - 11 Letters (convicted or orchestrating the attack
on the WRC in 1993)

Flight 11 - 92 on board - 9 + 2 = 11

Flight 77 - 65 on board - 6 + 5 = 11


~~~~~~~~~~~

i've some more to add to that...

numerology teaches us this about the number 11...

number 11 or number of truth
it is the number of maturity, lucidity, tenacity and serneity, for it indicates the longing to understand, know, experiment, penetrate, reveal and find the truth. It reinforces the logical mind and the ability to judge, severity, authority, strictness to the detriment of sensitivity, imagination and fantasty. It is also a 'master number', which means its more significant that the other numbers associated with numerology...

bunny

P.S. i'll edit this later...dinner is on the table

WOW

that is very deep were the hell did you get that its freaky

yeah i know it's freaky....got in my in-box

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i wonder who found all that out in the first place

it makes you think don't it

that my friend will be lost in the "fw" (forwards) of the space-time continumun thingy that is e-mails...



yes, it does.....

buns xxx

Interesting stuff, Bunny...

We should read if Nosferatu did mention that 11 in his poetries.

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it also claims that the footage of Palestinians dancing is not because of the WTC tragedy, it was because of the invasion of Kuwait. interesting stuff.

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I'm too young to have gone to Stanford, but I was born there while my father taught there and my mother went to law classes there.

Also, I sorta figured the Nostradamus thing wasnt right, it's what I thought first, but there're some friends who say things and you know you should listen, so I did.

Finally, I dont know much about numerology, so knew none of that about the number 11. But I'd say it might just be a random association, just like the association that the attack occured three months almost to the minute after Timothy McVeigh was executed. The most likely one was that an associate of bin Ladin's was to be tried on Sept. 12th in a courthouse which probably is no longer standing, which was across the street from one of the towers.

Also, just to interject a random thing or two. Did anyone hear how China found out about this? It was trinkled down from up top that America had been attacked, but only after we had first randomly and without reason attacked somewhere non-specific in the Middle East. Guess they dont want much sympathy for the US, despite declaring to be on our side. Also, three years ago the French government intercepted an attempt by bin Ladin to have a plane flown into the Eiffel tower. Just some fun factoids everyone would wanna know.

And I really dont blame the Palestinians for dancing and celebrating, even if it was about the WTC, just for the fact that I know there'll be at least that many Americans happy if we do something like kill bin Ladin or bomb the hell out of Afghanastan. I'm more pissed about what Saddam Hussein said in reaction, about us getting what we've been giving. Even if he's right, it's about 30 years too late and from the wrong part of the world, so he should probably just shut the fuck up and try not to piss us off, just sit and rejoice privately or something, maybe fall to his knees and thank Allah like bin Ladin did.

Okay, one last random thing: did anyone hear what Jerry Falwell had to say. I can expect and accept that some countries, especially those lead by a bastardization of the Muslim faith, would think we deserved what we got, but I never, ever thought we'd have white Christian Americans thinking the same thing. Basically, he said we deserved it for phasing religion out of much of public life and education. A bunch of other fairly extreme fucked up tv Christian-bastardizers said basically the same thing. From them, to be American and blame America, saying that what happened was the hand of God distributing retribution to us, is really fucked. I'd have thought they'd at least call it as bad as everyone else, if only because it was done by a group of people who couldnt make it into Bob Jones University or fit within the very stringent limits of Christian fundamentalism. If I cant expect ignorant rednecks like them to be racist enough to quit blaming American society for everything that happens, than what the fuck can I count on?

Oh, dancing and celebrating were they? Well even that fact may be in contention...

http://www.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=63288

"Newswire

There's an important point in the power of press, specifically the power of
CNN.
All around the world we are subjected to 3 or 4 huge news distributors, and
one
of them - as you well know - is CNN. Very well, I guess all of you have been
seeing (just as I've been) images from this company. In particular, one set
of
images called my attencion: the Palestinians celebrating the bombing, out on
the streets, eating some cake and
making funny faces for the camera.

Well, THOSE IMAGES WERE SHOT BACK IN 1991!!! Those are images of
Palestinians
celebrating the invasion of Kuwait! It's simply unacceptable that a
super-power
of comminications as CNN uses images which do not correspond to the reality
in
talking about so serious an issue.

A teacher of mine, here in Brazil, has videotapes recorded in 1991, with the
very same images; he's been sending emails to CNN, Globo (the major TV
network
in Brazil) and newspapers, denouncing what I myself classify as a crime
against
the public opinion. If anyone of you has access to this kind of files, serch
for it. In the meanwhile, I'll try to 'put my hands' on a copy of this tape.

But now, think for a moment about the impact of such images. Your people is
hurt, emotionally fragile, and this kind broadcast have very high
possibility
of causing waves of anger and rage against Palestinians.
It's simply irresponsible to show images such as those.

Finally, I'd like to say that we all regret and condemn all that has
happened
in the last days; but Nikos has a point here. I really don't want to be
misunderstood here, but the truth is that US government had shown no respect
for other countries in the last decades. In the 60s and 70s they had halped
lots of military coups throughout the world
(including Brazil in 64). Later, with Reagan and Bush Father, the Washington
Consensus have been demolishing the bases of our economies, making us more
and
more dependant (and, many of us, prehocupied with this situation).

Your current president quickly made things worse: Kyoto Protocol, Star Wars,
the exchange of rain forest for pieces of external debt, that abandonment of
the position of third party in negotiations between IRAK and England, and
between Palestinians and Israel. All those mistakes in US external politics
made your country more hatred than before, and, of
course, more vulnerable.

Listen, I'm NOT justifying the terrorist actions that took place in your
country; but it seems to me that, if your leaders had come along another
path
of thoughts and actions, you wouldn't be suffering what you are now.

Best regards, and the hope that everything is resolved for the best of all
of
us.

Mauricio A. V. Carvalho
State University of Campinas - Brazil"


To sum up, DON'T BELIEVE ANYTHING THEY TELL YOU.

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That earlier link you gave us, snopes or whatever, said it was a falsitude, Jim. Plus, I just said they were dancing and celebrating. I didnt say I knew when or what for, it was just in response to what atifman had just said. If this's right, I dont care much, personally, though it's definitely an injustice to Palestinians, cause I wasnt angry at all seeing that, and knowing it's for a different reason than I had first heard doesnt make me feel any differently towards the Palestinians.

And yeah, it may be our fault for getting these guy's opinions against us, but that started about fifty years ago in the middle east with us taking over Iran and backing Israel, and it's been flaring up for almost thirty years now, with bin Ladin himself posing a threat of some sort for about ten years in some way shape or form, so I dont think that the most recent actions of our government set this off. A few very probably boneheaded decisions cant be the only source of blame for forty to fifty years of building resentment. I think very little we've done in the last decade could affect the buildup to what happened recently, and I think that a guy with such an obvious grasp of international politics, especially in how they relate to the United States, shouldnt be overlooking the fact that our involvement in the Middle East and Muslim fundamentalism have always been inexorably linked and that something George W decided to do would not change that. Especially considering that this attack must have taken long enough to plan that it was started before he was in office, plus earlier attacks by bin Ladin, or, fuck it, any other fundamentalist terrorist, had occured well before our policies were changed by our current much-maligned president.

so they're bombing them (Afghanistan) now eh......whaddaya think?

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Go for it......we can't let the terrorists run around and kill anyone they want, can we? I think what's going on now is fine considering the situation and what's happened. I think as long as they keep the terrorists as their only target, then things should be ok.......unless some countries step in to defend the terrorists, but i think that'd be stupid with a large group of countries ready to back up the US.

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Yeah, I can't say that bombing the terrorists is bothering me much, I'm basically for it, but have about the same feelings as memnoch as far as other countries getting involved...

Still think it's real.

The early reports that there were street presentations in Palestine were shown on CNN with footage from the Gulf War. I've seen it confirmed in several places. Newsmedia people have an "understanding" about new which specifically concern them - so it makes sense that it never got released to the wire services if it DID happen.

But snopes sez? This I must see. Back soon.

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Bugger me. Snopes is all over this one like white on rice. Turns out I'm wrong.

No-one denies they were celebrating, the whole point was proving they could fuck with us any time they want to, those evil CNN people... guess I'd have to find another example... shouldn't be hard!

All the liberal philosophy in the world will not change the fact that
1) They declared WAR on white people
2) Their idea of war involves people getting very dead

So it's war. War involves goodies killing baddies. It's just HOW that we have to worry about.

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goddamn,people are still bitching about that?
its over,jesus christ.....
they fucked us,we fuck them,and its over.
and dont start bitching and whining at me because im not crying with you all.

What the fuck man??
Dude, he like totally asked us a question, so we fucking totally answered his question fuck. No one's crying jesus christ. So stop bitching about shit you don't understand man. Fuck! Now don't start yelling at me with your whining fuck!

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Shut up and never say anything ever again, you boring stupid little boy.

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Stick with this 6Morbid, if you don't want to hear people "bitching" about something, don't read the fucking thread.

i dont read the threads,i randomly post shit.
and i will talk,and im not a boy,so,there you go.
i know everyone hates me,but oh well,nothing will happen.

You're a girl???????

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ROFLMAO

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LOL!!

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yes,im a girl.....never talked with one before?

LOL!! oh fuck, i almost just fell off my fucking chair...aaahhh yea, thats good stuff! oh shit, i gotta wipe a tear outta my eye now

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Well, if you're a girl, that explains the never-ending bitch & moan syndrome. That's really too bad that you're always PMSing though, you must go through more eggs than most breakfast restaurants.

(A little sidenote, no offence intended to any ACTUAL women here at the forums )

whatever,your words mean nothing,stop trying so hard..

I'm not trying at all, my friend.

That just blew my mind. 6Morbid, you are now officially the most combative, belligerent, ill-tempered, malicious, malevolent, and downright unpleasant female I have ever encountered. Congratulations!

It's amazing because your general bad attitude towards everyone and everything screams "frustrated, aggressive adolescent male!"

Just when I think I got everything figgered out...

Shit yeah!

I always figured because you're a bitchy whiny little ball-deprived fucker that you were a teenage guy.

But I know why you're ball-deprived now... BECAUSE YOU'RE A WOMAN! Well, girl, really.

Damn, of all the things... That's a REAL turn-up for the books!
Would you other guys have suspected??? This is incredible. Like the time I thought that female bodybuilder was a guy.

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I did suspect something was odd about her cause she never stops complaining about everything going on in the forums. Just like your typical female i guess. (no offense to any others)

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oh no, she's the typical female, just +10 times or so...man, how bout that eh, totally explains EVERYTHING!

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It sure does.

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ummm.....hahaha

aw man, female bodybuilders have got to be unsexiest creatures on earth. totally nasty.


anyway, back to the topic, why isn't Bush giving the evidence to Afghanistan that bin Laden did the attacks? is it because he doesn't have any? if he does, i think it's moderately stupid that he's not giving them the evidence.

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