What are Dreams? What do you define as Dreaming? Are your Dreams real? How should we know, if reality isn't a dream/ is a dream.

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What a stupid question. No one knows what dreams truly are. And most people's theories are poorly thought out and moronic.

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Do you mean goals? I have them. Enough said.

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I don't think he meant goals.
No one can make the difference between dreams and reality.

Ahem. Yeah, uh, soul? I think he meant dreams as in when you are sleeping...

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I'm sure he means goals Why would anyone start a thread about sleep dreams

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Dreams are made up of sub concious(sp?) thoughts and don't mean anything.

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of course nobody knows the answer, but isn't it worth thinking about it for a while?

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No.

"The hesitation cultivates within the tired man and rumors spread of mutiny
and though the time will come when dream and day unite....
tonight the only consolation causing him to fight,in fearless faith in destiny"



sorry, Dream Theater lyric

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On the topic of dream/sleep/(mental weirdnes), I have a few things to say..

My bed is raised about 1.5m above the floor. A few days ago I woke, wondering what the fuck I was doing, sleeping on top of a skyscraper. It took me a second or so to realise I was in my bed....

And this morning I woke up feeling sad as hell, because both my ex-girlfriend (who I still kinda in a way feel for, but only in a way, ah whatever) (who was, shall we say, mentally not very well (suicidal)) and her mom had commited suicide just recently. After a minute or so, I realised that I had no reason to believe that they had commited suicide. I have felt a bit sad all day. I even thought about calling her just to see that she hasn't killed herself, but I don't think she'd enjoy that...

I know it's fairly OT, but I feel like saying it, and this thread is one of the best places...

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Whenever im in a dream and realize it, I always wake up.

Haven't had any recently, buy over the summer I have a shitload of fucked up dreams...its quit odd.....I've had a few were ive killed people and other crap like that.

I was at a party, and there was this really annoying guy, so I just simply PUT him in a toilet, and i didnt even know he would drown, I felt like I was helping everyone at the party by doing this in the dream, lol.

anyone ever had a lucid dream? i had one not too long ago thats some trippy shit


for those that dont know a lucid dream is when your dreaming and you realise your dreaming because of this you can control your dream

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I dreamed about this naked chick that I know in orchestra. I hope it comes true.....

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Guitar Demon, I'm actually researching this Phenomenal Happening a few years now. I experienced many diffrent kinds of lucid Dreams.....

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I've realized I was in a dream and could control it many times.

But the other night I had a dream where I was at this Amusement Park with Dave Chapelle and I was talking to this big random Coke Dealer.

One dream I remember pretty well is this one were I took acid in the dream, and I remembered I stabbed this black person and his body just disapeared..as well as other crazy shit because my mind thought I was on acid.

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Look into some Frued or Jung.

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hahaha thats awesome

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sometimes i realise im dreaming, like if im running from gangsters, fuck i hate trapped dreams. but i can never take control of my own dream, its kinda weird.

i once had a dream where someone came into my house and stole parts from my cellphone. i remember looking at my cellphone; the backplate, the battery and sim card were gone
in that area, there was a Post-it note attached: "Ha! This phone needs parts to work."

And I cried in the dream (in this same dream, my guitar had been stolen out of its case)

when i woke up, my eyes felt weird, like they were dry.

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ever had a dream that you thought was real? i had a dream once were i went into some random shop and the guy had a old 80's stealth for like 300 so i snatched it up and took it home, then i woke up and was like fuck im gonna spend all day playing my new stealth and went to get and realised i was just dreaming

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Lucid dreams are awesome. Check out ld4all.com for a good explanation on how to do it.

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I don't recall having any lucid dreams, but a few years ago i was having a nightmare, and i realised it, and i couldn't get out of it or wake up. And when i woke up in the morning, my eyelids were encrusted with dry blood

I've got other dreams that i enjoy, and have repeatedly, always in the same setting, but a different plot.

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I have a lot of lucid dreams at work, because I'm not a model employee. I had one that wasn't so much a lucid dream as a really vivid one where the world around me was very uncanny - almost right, but just a tad off. In it I called this girl I know and spoke to her for a while. That night, after I'd gone home from work and while she was drunk, she called back and asked me what was up with this long message I'd left her in the afternoon. I drove over and listened to it and got five minutes of me mumbling descriptions of what was happening and having one half of a very, very inane conversation. That was weird. I've done it before, but usually the person was in the room and actually talking back.

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I remember one night in my dream, i walked over to the toilet and unzipped my pants to go to the bathroom and I woke up and had to piss realy bad but i was to tired to get up so i just laid in bed for like an hour and held it in. It sucked
and no, i dident go in my bed...

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Ofcourse you didn't

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i find that with being old i get different problems, thus I dont get as much sleep as i used to and, concequently rarely(if ever) dream.

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20's old now, is it? Shit.

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I'm 19 and sometimes I feel like an old man. But it's not because of my blatter, it's because the way I talk and act. For instance, yesterday I was at a party with my roommate at this house full of kids. When dinner came around I didn't bother getting up because I told the lady I'd wait for the kids to eat first.

Ehh, but last night I also had some really weird dreams that didn't make any sense....I dreamed that I ran away from home with this chick and as I was screwing her at her place, her dad came, but as soon as I saw her dad, he turned into this guy I barely know who lives down the hall from me. Things got really strange after that but not sexual if that's what you guys are thinking. One time I had a dream that came true. THOSE are really fucked up.

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At 26 yo in the military I have dreams that only pychaitric help can understand now. I've had some crazy shit happen

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Aparently, well it is compareed to most of the other members anyway.


I used to ahev them all the time when I was shorter. They are fucking strange

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I've been able to tell the difference between dreams and reality for about 4 years now. 100% of the time I am awake, I see everything through my own eyes.

Here's the list of things that let me know I am dreaming-

1. 85% of the time I dream, I can see my whole self (including my face), to sum up I'm not seeing through my own eyes.

2. People, places, and objects will morph into other people, places, and objects.

3. Sometimes I fly. Seriously. I'm not flying very fast, only about twice as fast as I would walk. I'm also quite low, between 10 and 20 feet off the ground.

4. When I see animals in my dream (and I constantly do), they are never the same as real animals. I frequently find snakes in my dreams, and they are always way different than the snakes I find in real life. For example, I often find snakes with candy-cane patterns (none exist in Mass.), and I sometimes find tropical pit vipers.

5. In my dreams, I frequently know people that I don't know in real life (like Dave Mustaine) or people that don't even exist. I know them like we are best friends. For example, one time the lady that played the mother on "The Cosby Show" was my mother. I forget her name.

6. I occasionally kill people in my dreams. I never kill anybody in real life.

I use that as somewhat of a loosely defined checklist. I suggest you write down what you see in your dreams and make your own checklist. It works great.

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If that refers to me, I'm sure of it as it was SC's responce to my sarcastic remark before, then you have just wasted your time.

I know

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you guys are weird..

I never dream, cool kids dont need dreams.

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Wrong. It's a response to SpiritCrusher saying that it's impossible to tell the difference between dreams and reality. I'm pointing out that it is not at all impossible. It can be difficult, but far from impossible. I also shared some advice on how to figure out in a relatively easy way. Read the post, see for yourself.

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Ok, enough said. It just seemed like you were picking out something subtle that I that I thought might be vindictive toward me indirectly.

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You know, actually, Dave Mustaine no longer exists. Not in any way that matters, anyway.



You should really check this out. Maybe you do kill people in real life; for the sake of argument let's say just once, but you discounted it as a dream because you 'never kill anybody in real life.' Maybe it's time to look through recent murders in New Bedford.

I never really have a problem discerning a dream from reality, except when I get drunk enough that the next day I can only remember my actions through a murky haze full up with many dream-like distortions. But I found that, when I lived with my girlfriend, if one of us was awake and the other sleeping lightly enough, the sleeping one would begin having a conversation based on the dream. The waking one would respond, but the sense of what was said usually wouldn't penetrate and so we'd continue on, conversing like two people speaking related languages which only have moments of opacity for each other. Now I live alone, and if I say anything while I'm sleeping, nobody's around to tell me.

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Not at all. I don't really have any hostility toward anybody on this site except for the dicks that come here just to start trouble, most of whom are gone now anyway. I sensed a little bit of hostility in this post though, which was confirmed in the RTT thread. I'm assuming you understand now that I wasn't picking on you or anybody (other than aformentioned troublemakers). Hopefully you feel better now.

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I'm assuming this is a joke, but I'm going to entertain it regardless of whether it was or wasn't. There have been several murders in New Bedford in the past 7 days, but they were all shootings. I don't have a gun. I don't have a permit for one, and even if I wanted one, I don't have the money for one. Aside from that, most of these murders occur under unreasonable or incredible circumstances, and they are quite rare considering how often I dream. The murders are always associated with one of the items on my checklist.

#1. When I kill somebody in a dream, I NEVER see through my own eyes. I always see through my own eyes when I am conscious.

#2. When I kill somebody in a dream, it is always associated with people, places, and/or objects morphing.

#3. When I kill somebody in a dream, I often (but not always) fly away from the scene.

#4. When I kill somebody in a dream, it is often (but not always) in a dream where I intimately know somebody that I do not know in real life. For example, in the aforementioned dream where Phylicia Rashad was my mother, I killed a mentally challenged homeless man. This was in retaliation for an apparent murder of my sister, whom I was very close with. In real life I have two brothers, no sisters.

So I can check 4 of those off the list, and therefore it has been ruled out as a possibility. As I said before, I'd imagine this was a joke, but felt the need to respond anyway.

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Some yes.



But I got my eye on you Chris The Shit

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I used to piss my pants when I was young because of dreams of going to the bathroom all the time.

And just this summer I was dreaming about playing tennis, and then my mom woke me up and gave me the phone because my friend had called. He asked if I wanted to go play tennis...

That was the wierdest thing I ever dreamed about. Sure, I have lots of dreams where my alarm is actually going off, but in my dream it is going off for some other reason, and making the dream all wierd. But in this there was nothing that could have told me my friend was going to ask me to play tennis.

Maybe you just play lots of tennis.

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Hahaha, it's funny cause you openly said it on an online metal forum.

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It's not as though he loses anything more by your knowing it than you lose by his knowing that you have an unhealthy obsession with pizza.

Chris: yeah, I was joking. But you knew that.

Wasn't this thread meant to be more reflective/philosophical? Next I post here, I'll try and do a better job of living up to that.

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OOph, that put me in my spot.

I thought this was going to be like our ol' Philosophy thread where we all told our own little thoughts but it just turned out to be a "what are you dreaming now" thread. Sorry though, I have no thoughts on dreams.

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hahaha, i can picture that...haha

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I had this dream where I was laying in bed, and my dad said "its time to wake up." So I woke up and took a shower, preparing for school, but then I heard my mother yell "What are you doing, its 3 a.m.?" and so I felt like a dumbass and went back to sleep.

[QUOTE=Severed_Head_Stoner]i was having a nightmare, and i realised it, and i couldn't get out of it or wake up. And when i woke up in the morning, my eyelids were encrusted with dry blood QUOTE]

You must of been dreaming about seeing FearFrost's mother naked.

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What you should have said is:

[dissecton]"You fucking n00b. LOOK AT HTE ROLLING EYES SMILEY YOU MORON." [/dissection]

Hi,
I know that you (think) can easily make the difference between two states of mind, but how can you discern which one is reality and which one is the dream ? And also, couldn't the dreams be reality, and what you've always known as "real life" be the dreams ? Plus we all know our five senses often mislead us (ex: when you're drunk, when we take drugs). Why then wouldn't they be fooling us all the time ? We could be living in a continuous dream and we'd not even be aware of it.

About your list of things that let you know you're dreaming :
What makes you sure your eyes, for example (same goes for every sense if you think about it) are a good judge of what's going on outside of you? How many times did they cheat you (perspectives, hallucinations, mirages...)? And anyway, if your dreams are reality, then flying is possible (and in your current state of mind which would be the dream, it's not).

I know that might seem stupid because, as any sensible person here, I know I am not currently dreaming, and I also force myself to believe it (otherwise that would drive me insane). But I find it interesting that most of us can't answer the question without the use of opinions and self-proclamed theories (that wouldn't necessarly work for everybody). Of course, if anybody here knows a way to tell the difference between dreams and reality, I want to know it !
Also, sorry for the errors I might have done while typing this, english is not my first language and when comes the time to talk or write seriously I'm a total incompetent.
I'll come back to this later and add some more thoughts.

Ahhh dreams.. the dreams i get usually depend on what i wear in bed, if its usually boxers, i get random dreams, if i dont wear any socks i get really aggresive ones.. if i wear socks i usually dont get dreams.. there have been many situations in dreams where ive realised.. hmm this is a dream, and gone my own way about it, done what i wouldnt usually do in real life, also when being punched or shot or stabbed in a dream, i do feel it.. its weird, i also can taste when eating in a dream.. but my dreams are very random, like once i had this dream i was walking outside this place in venice when i found a mobile phone on the floor, i answered it, and this women was crying and kept asking me if i had a botsch Tv remote.. ive come across random ones, but i usually forget them..

And when shit stuff happens in your dream like your house being blown up or dog getting killed, and then you wake up its like such a relief, and its a pain when something good happens in your dream, and your so pleased.. and then you wake up.. and your like.. fuck


weird stuff..

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The way I can tell is simple. I don't do acid or shrooms. Not even PCP, mind you. No offense, but my eyes don't trick me when I'm conscious. Can I prove I know the difference? No. It doesn't matter. Nobody can prove that time exists, either. There's still a clock in my room to remind me when I need to get up. It's real to me. It's pretty obvious to me that dreams are nothing but you getting into your own mind. Your dreams often reflect what you think or how you feel. In your dreams you don't think at all, because the real you (the unconscious you) is already thinking.

Could you really sit here with a straight face and tell me that in a world where you can fly, where people morph into automobiles, where railroad tracks suddenly morph into a house, where you can get bitten by a king cobra and not care, where you have no thoughts- could you really tell me that's actual reality?

I definitely understand where you are coming from, don't misconstrue my words as anger, malevolence, or ignorance. I used to think about things like that all the time when I was 15. When I was 15, I used to argue with people about concepts of time and space, and reality, just because they couldn't prove I was wrong. The fact was that I was trying to trick myself into believing that garbage out of boredom, and also in an attempt to try to elevate myself to a higher spiritual status. There was always a part of me that knew the truth, and while I don't know for sure, I'd wager a bet that part is also in you.

Another thing I can say about that manner of thinking is that the people who often come up with things like that are highly intelligent people who are either in their teens or who do drugs and never really grew up. I'm not trying to stereotype you or anything, but ask yourself if you fit into either of those categories. Are you a highly intelligent teenager (as I'm betting you are)? Are you a highly intelligent burnout in your mid-20's who plays PlayStation all day? That would probably explain some of it.

The reasons for this is that highly intelligent people (especially teenagers and drug users who never grew up) have a knack for challenging authority and the biggest way they do that is by trying to break down what are generally accepted as "facts" by showing that either A: those facts are false, or B: those facts can not be proven. I was exactly like that, and I've actually wagered the same argument you are wagering now until I decided I was going to try to understand my dreams and find out for myself the true concepts of reality. I also broke down the concept of religion, which I found to be totally false, and I'm betting you are an atheist. I still am an atheist to this day. You have a hungry mind. Some of the things you "discover" will be true, and others will be false.

By the way, don't worry about your English, it's fine.

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my dreams are becoming a health hazard. like recently, ive been having dreams of falling (anywhere from out of aeroplanes into the ocean, to falling off stadium light towers into the seats) and my heart has stopped for up to 5 seconds because i could actually feel the falling (although oddly, not the impact).

yeah me too..falling outta planes

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Well, strange things do happen all the time: in the Quantum Mechanical realm. Particles can be in two places at once and can pass through barriers unhindered. Even your whole body has an associated wavelength (as proven by De Brolie at the turn of the 20th century). These strange occurances have all been proven mathematically and observed in experiments.

When you also consider that a physicist (his name escapes me) recently had an article published in New Scientist stating that it is statistically more likely that we are living in a computer simulation (a la The Matrix) than the 'real' world, further ammunition is provided.

However, I don't think that dreams are easily confused with reality, that's just my opinion, but things may not be as black and white as we think they are.

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I personally think that everything we percieve, if it is the physical world or the dream world, is reality. My Theory has many similarities with the occult views on dreams and reality. I Acctually think that our mind is a vehicle, in which we can travel through diffrent dimensions. Our physical body stays in the physical plane, because it is a vehicle for our mind. Every human being has been at the Astral plane, the dimension where all our dreams take place. A Dimension that we can experience counscious when we get lucid. In this dimension, our thoughts make the world. Our nightmares get real, our wishes come true. Of course, because this world is made up of our thoughts, we can control it. For example we can change the physical properties of this world. We suddenly can fly, like some people experienced in their dreams here, we can go through walls and even change the way living beings in this world act to you. Although all the thought of every human being is represented in the astral plane, you cannot see the World of another person. The only way to communicate in this world is via telepathy. I have become now very often lucid in this Astral plane, and I know how my world, created deep in my mind, looks like.

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Haha, no, I don't really fall in either one of the categories you previously mentioned (I don't have a Playstation, I'm not really into drugs and I'm not incredibly intelligent either). What I was talking about was simply a theory called solipcism (continuous dream), discovered by Descartes I believe. He found his way out of this vicious circle by proving God's existence, using scientific method and arguments to build up his theories. Of course you can't prove God's existence in a mathematical way like he did (he thought science could solve everything, which is false even if it helps a lot), so what he was saying at the time, even if it's still interesting, has lost its value now. But that's a bit off-topic.

It is true that, since birth, you (same goes for everybody) have learned a lot of things without really learning them : you've assimilated a lot of information, but you still don't know where it comes from. If you start thinking about it seriously, senses, for example, can't be trusted. Have you ever dreamed about something really simple and boring and realistic, like for example that you're waking up after a long sleep and turning your alarm clock off ; but then you really wake up and understand it was only a dream because you alarm clock is still buzzing? How could you make the difference between those two states of mind ?
When you're about to fall asleep, I'm sure you've already experienced all sorts of strange dreams which were not, or strange real things that you'd actually dreamed of. Then how could you be completely sure that you know how to make the difference between dreams and reality, except by saying "I know it" ?
You say that time, for example, is "real to you". Then, and that's cool (because we all need to do that), you're proving to yourself things that are not necessarly true just to make sure you won't turn insane thinking about it. You also say that a part of me knows the truth, but it's false : I'm sure I know the truth, I know that right now I am not dreaming and that in a couple of hours I'll be. But that again, is not solving the problem, it's only a shortcut everybody's taking because it's easier like that.

My point was, no, I couldn't sit here with a straight face and tell you that reality is a world in which I can fly, because we haven't defined yet what is reality and what are the dreams ; but these kind of questions, I'll never be able to sit here with a straight face and tell you they don't bother me.
Even if you finally manage to convince me that these questions are futile, for all that they won't be solved. Well I'm feeling now I've been repeating the same thing twenty times in row so I'll stop talking about this.
One last thing, when you say, "Some of the things you "discover" will be true, and others will be false", I can't agree. Life is ambiguous, mankind is paradoxical by nature, and the way we live and think is only a matter of choice. As John said, "things may not be as black and white as we think they are".

I had not seen you post before posting mine. It seems to me that what you're stating here is more a representation of Freud's theories (about the links between conscious and subconscious states) than a way to explain the difference between dreams and reality... Tell me if I'm wrong, but you're saying our mind is independant from our body ? So if you die, will you continue to live in the Astral plane ? I have no time now to continue writing on this topic but I'll come back tonight.

Great words. So true.

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Hahaha you guys sure are clumsy in your dreams..

Nah i have random stuff like that, i would be on a roof on a bike and id wheel myself off of it, and id be bracing myself so much, and i could feel it in my own body just all tightening up and stuff.. and then the impact just doesent happen.. but most normal things like people stabbing you in your dreams i usually feel these random stings, and when im punching in my dreams its real hard too, it feels like someone has strapped a 15stone weight on the back of my arm, its like somethings slowing my down and it does aggrivate me quite a lot, cos i cant really punch properly in my dream sometimes, it might because of how my arms are positioned when im sleeping at that precise moment..

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Exacly, our mind is independent from our physical body. Thats why some call the astral projection, OOBE (Out of Body Experience). When you are dead, you acctually can go to planes/dimensions that the normal mind would never have reached, for example the Atmic, Anupadaka and the Adi plane. This furthest the human living mind can go is to the Buddic Plane. This plane can only be reached by a special form of meditation. I don't know exacly how the experience differ from plane to plane. I the furthest I could go was to the Mental plane, the diffrence from the astral plane was that my vehicle in this plane was not represented as a human body, more of a ball like liquid. My last OOBE took place yesterday night. This one took place in the Astral Plane, because I had the ability to change. This time I tried a new experiment, and acctually I'm happy to say that it worked. I knew I was dreaming, but I was not yet completely lucid. My experiment was to change continuance in a dream. After I have experienced my dream, where I die at the end, I wanted to get lucid. Acctually it never really works to get lucid after you died in a dream. This time it suprisingly did work out. Well after I have become lucid, I wanted to travel back in time, to kill the people before they kill me again. And it WORKED! I knew exacly what would happen, every happening/ action around me, I could predict. At the end, i just went another direction, which resulted that i didn't get killed.

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You did a great job stating your points. That being said, I have not chosen the easy path because I'm afraid of going insane. Finding out that I had a skewed concept of reality is far from a reason to cause my insanity. I have many more legitimate problems that would cause my insanity before that, any one of them could possibly cause a breakdown. There are many problems that I haven't solved, many things I do not know, and these things do not cause me to go insane. These things that I do not know are far more important to me than anybody's concept of reality. My life's love is generally associated with the field of biology, and there are many things about biology that I do not (and possibly can not) know, and if not knowing things that mean so much to me does not cause a breakdown of my sanity, I sincerely doubt something as inconsequential as personal concepts of reality would.

It's easier for me to differentiate between dreams and reality partly because of the list I wrote. It certainly wouldn't make much logical sense for my real life to be broken down into short periods of an hour, 20 minutes, 30 minutes, over a night. Especially when that life consists of doing such seemingly unrealistic things. You don't dream the whole time you are asleep, you dream in small frames, and that makes that argument even less valid. Just think about a scenario where, say, I'm dreaming for about 1 hour and 15 minutes. It consists of me investigating a mansion with lots of hidden doors and trap doors, with morphing walls, finding drugs in the mansion, getting chased out of the mansion by 9 foot tall drug dealers. Now all of a sudden I'm mad, because it turns out I own the mansion. I throw a rock at the mansion, somehow killing 2 of the drug dealers and satisfying me anough so that I can now fly away to the woods where, suddenly, I don't even remember the mansion. Now I'm worried about snakes, so I look for them for about 2 minutes, when I find about 30 of them under one board, of varying sizes and colors, including a bright blue Heterodon platirhinos with a tiny head and a body about 12 inches thick. Then all of a sudden there is a highway cutting through the woods, so I hitchike a ride (even though I can fly, and would never hitchhike anyway) to Tulsa, Oklahoma. It doesn't matter, because when I get to Tulsa, it's really Taunton, Massachusetts. I go to visit my grandmother, but it turns out my evil cousin is there, and we have huge showdown in front of city hall like in a western movie. Nobody throws a punch or anything, but he falls down anyway, and then I look over to my aunt (who was never there before) and say, "let's get out of here". We then drive away in a car (which wasn't there before either), and she turns into my best friend Matt while she's in there. So we drive around looking for pussy for no real reason. Somehow we end up in Africa. Then I wake up.

Is that my REAL life? I guess I can't prove it isn't, but logical sense tells me that it isn't.

I also believe that while science can't currently prove or disprove everything, I expect the future to find science solving many problems we currently have, but as long as we find out more, there will be more we find out we don't know. Nobody will ever know everything. Not when you live in an infinite universe, it simply isn't possible. The problem is, as I said, when science solves mysteries, more mysteries will be opened up. It's neverending. All you can do is trust science, I know I do.

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i bet chris dreams about a new guitar

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^^ me tooo......playing with DiGiorgios translucent black 5 string fretless esp

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No, but I sure do daydream about one. Or several. Or like a hundred. With built in vaginas, therefore eliminating the need for women. It's my daydream, I'll do whatever I want.

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Well, I guess we agree on almost everything except for the fact that I don't trust science as much as I think you do. But I do appreciate its benefits a lot. Without science, we wouldn't have had this little conversation, and I'd still be baking eggs on a fire, which would certainly be a mess.

Man, ya gotta have respect for the rest of the body, the warm feeling of them while your using the vagina

Every dream of mine is "lucid" then. I control everything! I fuckin love my dreams. they are better than my actual life, which is sad, maybe. My dreams are pretty much all about girls. but i really like them. i remember all of them too. and sometimes i tell people in my dream that its my dream, they just say they know that already, which sometimes seems strange.

One time i was having this amazing dream. I was with this girl and i fucking loved her. Everything was beautiful. The sky was green and purple. anyway, when i told her it was a dream and i would have to wake up eventually she was so confused, then sad. I never wanted to wake up. I just wanted to spend the rest of my life in this perfect dream. In fact when i did wake up i was sad. depressed even. dreams are insane.

found out a scary thing last night from my gf

apparently if you dream your falling off a cliff, you can die when you dream you hit the ground (heart attack.) but then, i dont see how its possible, and also i suppose nobodys lived to tell the tale.

Ive hit the floor from a cliff jump or building jump many times.. never experienced that..

EDIT: in my dream of course..

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lol

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you rule

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It's not possible for her to know this then. It's just a myth.

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for the purpose of hijacking the RTT, here we are: THE DREAMS THREAD!!

The more I know about our world the more questions I have. I know the answers to some questions that many need secretity clearence for but still I don't know if ET aliens are real?

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does anyone ever wonder what people could do if they could use 100% of their brain? Cause don't we use only 5% or something...crazy

(i just thought i'd say something like this because of the discussion of thinking in dreams and shit)

some days I use about 60%

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I may be wrong but I've read somewhere that the whole " we use 10% of our brain" is a myth.

That sounds like you know that for a fact.

On the topic of dreams... I had a really weird dream when I was younger. It was a lucid dream. I realized it was in the middle of the dream, while I was standing in a boat, next to this random girl. I immediately pulled down my pants... she made a disturbed face and walked away. Then my friend, Lillie, pulled my nostrils open really wide... and I was watching myself from a third person view. It was really stupid. Chromatic excercises are good.

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I think this is correct. We do use more then what is believed, at most times of the day depending on what is happening.

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You might need to listen to some KoRn and then report back here.

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me too man, me too. i sometimes just sit and just think about the world, where we are, why we are here, it can be pretty interesting.

Yup, and then I find myself being apart of what I don't what to see. Know what I mean? Or just feeling the way you where always told not to feel?

It is hard to tell online though, but I think you know kinda what struggle is about.

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I keep a dream journal, and have been for about two years. I remember on average about three full dreams a night, sometimes as many as six, sometimes only a single fragment. But I always remember and record. This being stated, I have never seen any significance of dreams. From what I gather they are entirely composed of the most randomest (is that a word?) thoughts from the day. I have never experienced prophecy in the dream world, or any kind of problem solving.

However, if you can induce a specific dream situation, you may find a may at working out a problem. This can be useful.

I've had a few lucid dream experiences, but they are extremely difficult for me to achieve. Right now I am going through Robert Bruce's "Astral Projection In 90 Days". You may be thinking it's a scam, but it isn't. If you pick up Sir Bruce's first book, it gives very detailed methods and descriptions of achieving the astral. This 90 Day program merely takes his methods from the first book and organizes them in a step by step program manner. Today is Day 28 for me, and learning how to lucid dream is part of the program; I'm hoping I can become regularly lucid before long.

The program focuses at first on stimulating your "energy body". I must say, I would like to hear someone's scientific theories on how I can feel rushes of energy through my body with just a thought, stimulate my chakras and feel intense sensations there, and just feel overall more clearheaded after doing these exercises. Certainly, I cannot think of a physiological explanation. I'm just writing this for the cynics out there. You cannot say this is an illusion, because I can put my hand on the spot and feel energy there! Pulsing, throbbing, energy! This program has already brought a comfort to my consciousness, that I have a spirit. I feel my energy body each day, and this is what I must take with me to the astral. I highly recommend this if you are interested in anything metaphysical. Robert Bruce's first book is like my equivalent to a Bible.

This is a little off topic, but il post anyway.

My friend kind of came up with a way to explain that theres a difference between spirit and body and death is not the end. He basicaly stated that since concious(and emotion) isnt something that you can physicaly see or touch then how could it die? the only thing i can think of right now that relates to conciousness that you cant see or touch(which means it isnt physical) is gravity. My friend was alot better at explaining this then i am, hopefuly you all get what im trying to say though.

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I can't see or touch you, so are you really there? And would I care if you got run over by a bus?

This thread is fingernails across the blackboard of science and philosophy.

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yes im really here, just like gravity and conciousness. I never said anything about either gravity or conciousness not being there.

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Where exactly is your spirit? I'm quite curious about this. Do you have any pictures of it? Can you pinpoint it's location in your body? Does it hover outside of your body?

Spirits don't exist and are nothing more than a figment of human imagination. People have told me that they feel their spirits there, even gone to the trouble of trying to explain to me exactly what their spirit is and does, the problem is that every single time they do they are pointing out specific attributes of the brain.

It also amazes me how people try to tell me how spirits simply must exist, for they have seen a show where somebody else saw a ghost. There isn't enough room on this planet for the spirits of every single person that has died. When I point this out, some try to explain it away by saying that spirits traverse to a seperate plane. Well, if they do that, how are they haunting houses and appearing out of nowhere in the middle of the woods?

The problem, quite bluntly, is that people have such an exaggerated sense of self-importance that they will do anything to delude themselves into believing that they have souls that will continue to exist forever, because they can't come to terms with the fact that one day they will simply cease to exist, and that's the end of it. If it makes one feel better, I guess you could always say that at least your energy will be transfered directly or indirectly to animals, plants, or mineral, and in that way, you will exist forever.

People that specifically refer to 'energy' (especially in reference with it being physically palpable) need to talk with JohnMansley as soon as possible.

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Yeah, bring it on bitches!

Seriously, Conservation Of Energy. Google search it - you might learn something.

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1st law of thermodynamics might render better results since the 2nd law doesnt really have anything to do with the whole conservation

The energy body is intimately connected with the physical. Obviously I am not going to change anyone's mind, but I know what I have felt. Anyone who has seriously given astral projection multiple tries cannot dismiss the sensations as fake or an illusion.

From Nietzsche, "Let us beware of saying that death is the opposite of life. The living being is only a species of the dead, and a very rare species."

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Dreaming you woke from a dream.....but are still dreaming....that's funky!!!!

The only thing that is really annoying is when people try to read symbolism into anothers dreams......kinda silly if you ask me.

I don't see why I can't dismiss it as fake or an illusion. After all, in my dreams I fly, and it really feels like I'm flying, but when I wake up I realize it was just an illusion. Boys in the later stages of puberty can have dreams that they are having sex, and it will be so real they will literally orgasm. This happened to me as a kid, it was so real I could literally feel it. It was just an illusion.

I frequently have dreams where I'm finding all kinds of strange animals, I'm catching these snakes, and they are right in my hand, I'm holding them, feeling them on my skin. I'm looking at these snakes, and I can see their individual scales. I can even tell if the scales were keeled or smooth. It's so real... and then I wake up.

Dreams can feel like real life and often do, and then sometimes they don't. They are still just dreams. If you think about projecting yourself outside of your body enough, it's only natural that you will eventually dream it, and it will feel real. The problem is that you can not project yourself outside of your body, because everything that is yourself resides within your body. You can't project your consciousness outside of your body because it's merely a function of your brain. It isn't something physical that can be seperated.

If you really want to try astral projection, go to sleep, have somebody you don't know come to your house and put something in your room, but far away enough not to wake you up. Then, when you wake up, tell me what it is. Even this plan is flawed, considered the cycles in which humans sleep and the frequency in which people wake up and are semi-conscious in the middle of the night.

As satisfied as I am with my debunking, I have a feeling John would do an even more thorough and detailed job. He understands matter and physics as well or better than I understand biology and evolution.

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I don't understand the concept of your project...plus, what does this have to do with evolution? Humans probably won't evolve anytime soon because we can shape our environment to fit our needs, little natural selection occurs due to genetic drift because populations are so high, and were probably closest to equilibrium than ever.

anyway, could you explain your astral project a bit more, it sounds sort of intriguing

My post doesn't have anything to do with evolution, nor does the topic, rendering your rebuttal irrelevant. If you would like to learn more about human evolution, PM me, I'd be more than happy to answer any questions you might have.

As for astral projection, it's fake, it's not my theory. I merely proposed a rather simple way of trying to prove whether or not it's real, unfortunately, this method is flawed and could only prove that it's fake, which I guess would really be the only solution anyway, since it is fake.

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I'm not writing about dreams, or how real dreams feel. I'm writing about what I feel when I am meditating, or any time I'm sitting down. I pull energy up though my legs and bounce it through my body. This is what I feel in WAKING CONSCIOUS LIFE. It is not an illusion.

And I have a better way to prove the projection to myself. I have a card on top of my bookcase, and I have no idea what card it is. Upon projecting in the following weeks, all I have to do is view the card in the astral and compare it to the one in waking conscious life. If if is not the same, so be it. But if it is, your argument will be proven specious, at least to myself.

So your spirit can actually flip the card over? That's interesting. I'd like to see this, I'm not sure what would happen. Would I see your spirit, or would I only see the card flipping itself over? What you need to do is get a camcorder and set it to record the card on your nightstand (or wherever you keep it), this way, when your spirit flips it over, we can all see it an be amazed.

Now, surely your spirit must flip the card over, because if it doesn't, you've flipped it over on your own while awake, and then you've already seen it.

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You're thinking too hard about it. The card is already face up on top of my bookshelf. I did not have to look at it to raise it up face-up and put it on top. And even if I did have to turn it over, no one would see it, because the astral is a separate dimension from the physical reality. There is the real-time zone, basically a copy of the physical world. And then there are higher astral planes.

All this is hypothesis. If there were actual proof...we'd ALL know about it by now.
Remnants from snake oil salesman days.
With mans propensity for greed....it would have been further exploited beyond "Projecting For Dummies" lol