well i bought my SS-140C with a BFI...... and im





disappointed. it does not have nearly as much gain as i thought it would have and even with mids scooped, it sounds like it has mids on six. if anyone has anything to help me that would be great. I tried smackin the top of it, as some people say that that helps the problem, but it didn't work. What could be wrong with the amp. THe guy that i bought it from did something where he did something with the FX Loop. Soeru knows what he did.
But im pretty sure he didn't do anything else with it. So yah, help me out

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The hell, are you using the high gain input? Are both guitar inputs functional? I can think of half a dozen problems an SS-140 could have, but lack of gain aint one of them! Don't scoop your mids. Keep everything at 12 o clock and tweak from there.

Btw did you buy the blue line SS's or the all-black ones?

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my SS is this exact oneSS-140C

my guitar is an EMG-81 so the wood don't matter, it is in the high output channel but the guy did say he did handiwork on it so it might be switched. ill try that

how dare you tell me what to do with my mids!

if i wanted Gorguts: EoS or CD, i should have it scooped right?

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it is very sterile and kinda seethrough if you know what i mean.
It just doesn't have enough bite or heaviness at all.

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Try it with a different cabinet and see if it helps any. If not...take it to someone who knows what theyre doing to check it out. These things are old, and have numerous issues common to them. Like I mentioned before...me and someone else I know had the same identical Ampeg (blue early series ss-140c) and his sounded very weak and muddy compared to mine. I'm assuming there was something wrong with his, just because mine was a near mint clean one owner with the original box and everything lol.


By the way...with all the Ampeg threads popping up...maybe we should combine or resort to posting topics on solid state Ampegs in one big thread?

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Yeah the early blue line series had less gain than the modern SS's, but yours is one of the newer ones.

If you don't feel that the Ampeg has TOO MUCH gain then you can bet your ass something's wrong with it! I have no clue how much it would cost to repair that, that is if it even needs a repair.

And no, don't scoop your mids to 0, keep them in there like at 12 o clock, then boost your bass and treble from there too but don't cut those mids.

You ARE using the high gain input right? Not the low gain input with the gain maxed?! Have you tried both inputs?

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First thing I would do with any used amp is clean the pots, its amazing how much difference it can make. Dirty pots affect the range + engagement of the particular knob. Also clean out all the input jacks and the FX loop jacks.

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Yeah definitely, but even with non fully functional pots he should still get assloads of gain out of it! I'm almost certain he's using the wrong input jack for the clean channel, use the B channel!.

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Edit: i don't really get what you mean by this. im plugged in high input jack on A channel. B chanell?!?!?! my ampeg's distortion is on the A channel! there are only two inputs labeled high and low. I plug into high and with gain at FULL! it gives me this shitty MG tone

How do you clean pots? like where are they in the head? easy to reach?

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^ B is the clean channel ...

the best and only decent A setting i've been able to find on mine is
low: 5
mid: 8-10
high: 5
with the mids scooped it just sounds like metalzone fizz.

in that setting it's kind of like mellowed out tube overdrive. but yeah, the tone does suck.

i've tried running it preamp out into my computer then through modelling software. i'll post some clips of this scenario later tonight so you guys can hear for yourselves.

You know what, I don't really know , I guess its just all the wiring/shafts etc behind the knobs and same on the inside. I've never actually done it myself, I always take my amps to a tech to get them cleaned up. Less chance of death that way

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There's usually some sort of hole in the potentiometers that you can spray contact cleaner into. Spray once, rock back and forth a couple of times, then spray once more (don't skimp on it this time) to flush all the crap out.

Anyway dirty pots should not have a huge effect on gain/distortion. The main problem i have when buying used gear from around the 80's-90's is the input jack, which is usually dirty as hell (and especially if it hasn't been used in a while).

To diagnose this try moving your plug around in the jack while playing to see if you can hear a difference, and, anyway, spray the jack hole full of cleaner in all directions (bend the nozzle inside), spray the jack plug, then plug it in, take it out, rotate it around, plug in / out etc and leave the plug in the jack for an hour while the cleaner evaporates. Then do it one more time, this time more of a flush so spray plenty, then try playing it once it has dried out. Doesn't matter if you spill the cleaner all over the place or if it drips down from the jack or whatever, it dries out and leaves no trace (but it might clean affected areas so they might look different, but they're supposed to look like that).

Now if that doesn't fix it the jack might be loose, then you can bend the tip of the jack back in place to tighten it up. Works on closed jacks as well, just use a #0 flathead screwdriver or something similar to push the tip back in place through the small holes in the jack.

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In some sense thats true, the preamp itself isn't affected but if the pots aren't engaging right then it isn't interacting 100% with the gain section. I've had dirty pots that impaired the volume because it physically wasn't cranking the amp.

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any problems that could be directly related to the preamp?

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Never heard of any preamp issues with the Ampegs, only poweramp failures on some of the VH's and minor input jack problems that might appear like they're serious but aren't.

Take it to a tech, have him check all of it out to see if there's anything burned in it or if you have a "channel switching" problem where the 2nd channel bleeds through into your other one and gives crappy tone.

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k. i emailed some tech guys that ampeg referred me too

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here's a recording of my ss140c head (blue series) going direct preamp-out into GR2.

in GR2 there are no additional amps or fx, i've just got it going input to 2 cabs ... the 1960 4x12 and the chief 2x12, both mic'd on axis w dynamic 57.

this should give you an accurate representation of the tone of this amp. i didn't record it coming out of my marshall 4x12 because it sounded really bad (probably the cab and not the head).

anyways there are two mp3s zip'd. one setting is mids at 10, the other is mids scooped to 5. high and low are at 5 in both.

lmk if this sounds right.

Attached Files

ss140.zip (484.6 KB, 254 views)

Hey man they sounded pretty good! I liked the mids 10 one quite a bit, that's the kind of tone I love. What is the GR2? Is it a mic pre/interface?

That's a blue line series? Has a lot more gain than what I thought it would compared to the all black SS's. Awesome!

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gr2 = guitar rig 2 ... the NI modeling software. when i recorded the head direct without a simulated cab, it just sounded like fizz. but yea i tried to keep it as pure as possible.

Did you use the XLR outs when recording direct? Or did you use one of the 1/4"? It's possible that the XLR and 1/4" on old equipment may not put out a balanced, record-friendly signal, these days the direct outs on amps and stuff are much much better designed and give you less fizz...

And yeah you need cab simulation to kill some of that fizzy highend when going direct, that's what a real cab does to your tone, round it out a bit and make it more pleasing to the ear..

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oh i am soooo relieved!
my head dreams of gain like that!!
now i know that there is something that can be fixed in it
that or my cab is god AWFUL! does anyone know anything about it?
it's labeled BFI Bullfrog Systems

BTW send me your album man, i like your music

soeru> i tried the xlr (marked as balanced) and the 1/4. they sound pretty similar. i only wish it sounded like this coming out of a real cab!

joam> mine sounds shitty through a cab as well. might be stereo vs mono issue like josh suggested. i'm going to try to find an original matching cab to try it on. try running your preamp out and see if thats got enough gain. it's the suffo 'pierced' intro btw.

Yeah don't be fooled, the old blue ones are just as brutal as a later SS. I think they were all the same up until the VH series intro, that was when the changes were made. I actually like the sparkly grillecloth on them. Although it looks more like something the Strokes would play through than a death metal amp lol. By the way...Assuck used to use SS-140c 's, so thats another band to check out if you want an idea of the tone..altho a lot of their recordings are shitty quality.

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your cab is a piece of shit isnt it? i thought we already established this... blame it on that dude

honestly, new speakers can make a world of difference.

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yeah ill sell it to a noob, however it is fukkin loud. but yah it blows.
im takin my head to a techie tommorrow to see if everythings OK

I took my amp to a guitar center and the guys there knew absolutely nothing

I said "hey i got one of these old SS-140C's and im pretty sure theres something wrong with it. either that or i have really worn out cab.
he takes me to a mesa cab. and i play and as usual, hair metal tone

and you can quote me on this "everything sounds fine, its sounding how it should, blah dee fukkin dah, i get reamed by john adams zombie corpse flying at my asshole on a bicycle made out of ham sandwiches"
so he was an idiot.
he couldn't help me at all, so im takin it to a local music repair store where i should have gone in the first place

make a list of problems it could have:

Input jacks
Output jacks
Pots
buttons/switches


Honestly, if you just get them to replace all of those, you should technically be in happytown.

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i dunno i think it is more major than that. the guy said that when you have dirty pots you hear a crackling sound. i just want it to sound like it should. with those what could be some signs of badness, like for the input for instance how would i know if it was shot to hell?

so mine sounds like shit through a mono cab and so does joam's. is it imperative to have a stereo cab for these to work properly?

can someone also explain what the 'ext' / 'int' labels refer to on the speaker out jacks. thx

One is wet and one is dry, for the effects on the amp. Mine sounded better with a stereo cab, a lot clearer and less muddy, but the main problem I had before I got a stereo cab was the chorus made noise and sounded horrible. It always had more than enough distortion...there has to be something wrong with yours. I wish I was more electronically adept to help more, but I assure you these are not normally shitty sounding amps.

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i called the gyu who would repair it and he told me hat noting was wrong with it when he tore it apart
he said that also the EQ was before the distortion and that the Dist. wasn't shaped by the EQ's but that the EQ's just chose where the DIst. went

AAAAARRRGHHHH! He said it was in perfect condition.
ill try to play it really loud today and see if it is good at loud volumes

Stab him in the throat, he's lying.

I'm sitting here with the schematics for the VH-140C... It's not the SS but listen.

Signal path is like this:
First comes a small gain stage for channel A/B shared, then (for channel A, which is high-gain) two stages of gain, and then comes the gain pot. After that there's an active EQ, first comes mid, then treble, then bass, and after that is the channel vol. control, and the signal is being passed from there to the FX loop.

Block diagram of signal:

Input->Shared gain stage->Two gain stages specific to channel A->Mid active EQ band->High active EQ band->Low active EQ band->Vol control->FX Loop.

To tell you the truth, these amps are constructed very, very similarly. The VH adds "variable harmonics" to the SS series, nothing more. Feels a little less tight, more responsive, a little "saggy".. A little more like a tube amp, that is. Differences are mostly in the power section. Tone is by all means nearly the same, I've A/B tested them.

E-mail Bob.Joyce@loudtechinc.com and tell him about your problem and tell him you need a schematic, he'll get back to you in a matter of hours. He doesn't say much but does what he's asked. Then try finding someone who's not bullshitting you to fix the amp, any local electronics repair shop will do (music stores are mostly owned / ran by complete morons and/or frauds).

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jopop, my A channel sounds good from the preamp out, but when run through a cab it sounds like shit. the B channel is fine both ways. where would the problem most likely be? should i take it in / would i need that schematic? thx

Sounds like shit through a cab? The poweramp is failing most likely.

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but the clean channel is fine. and there are 2 separate poweramps.

Your amp is just fucked man, however and wherever it may be. A fully working Ampeg SS-140 or VH-140 should yield month long erections.

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bah i'll take it in
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WwKvX37d8Zc

thanks jopop i emailed the guy
does he mail back promptly? last time i mailed loudtechnic some guy mailed back a week later saying that it was meant to be a preamp and i should buy a poweramp or some bullshit

BTW the guy i took it to was a local repairmen and appeared to be VERY competent

I wonder if the guy who sold it to me messed with it?

Hm he replied to me in an hour.
Seriously.. you say it doesn't have enough gain still.. there are generally only one part that may wear out in a preamp: polarized capacitors. Other things may blow due to overheating (opamps, transistors, resistors) or overvoltage (non-polarized capacitors) but that is very unlikely.. plus the effect would be more dramatic in most cases..

Anyway. Symptoms of one or more worn electrolytic (polarized) capacitors:
#1 Lack of gain
#2 Lack of bass/low mids
#3 Very thin tone.

If you have those symptoms (all of them) it might be the issue.. but if you had a respectable repairman look at it I'm sure he would've seen it..

And about your poweramp (on VH-140C) only sounding good on one channel: What's bad? Does the preamp still sound fine on both channels? Thanks!

Edit: Okay the preamp sounds fine.. sorry.

I have the schematic(s) but they're too large to post here.. (>2MB). I'll email them to whoever though.

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They're both SS's btw.

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Ah, wait till joamdude gets a reply then.

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I was surprized my Crate GX130C head did not have more Gain as well. The way people talk it should kill everything at alike 3 or 4, I have it on 10 and need an EQ pedal in the loop to boost it.

Maybe I was just expecting more!!!


Peter

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I'm suprised too man, as similar as everyone says that head is to the VH140c, you should be fine with the gain at like 4 1/2 and find that everything over is too much. That's how it is on my VH140c anyway. Maybe something's up with it?

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Dirty contacts? Bad guitar cable?

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Mine doesn't have an overload of gain, but definitely has enough, more than I would use in a practical setting. Most of it find from 8-10 on the knob, and I usually run mine a hair over 9. I notice between 9 and 10 there is more of a noticeable increase in the gain as opposed to the increases between the other positions.

If its any help, these are my settings, on a fully functional (1988ish blue series) SS-140c through a 300w Ampeg SS-412 cab with whatever Celestions they came with (GT-12 75s?)

Channel 1 (Distortion): Gain 9 1/3, Bass 6 1/2, Mid 7, High 8
Channel 2 (Clean): Gain 4, Bass 6, Mids 7, High 8, bright switch off.

I apologize in advance if these settings sound like shit, but they're working well for me. I know nobody cares about the clean setting but I figured I'd include it anyway. If you roll back the mids to 4 or 5 and the high around 6 on Channel 1 it will give you more of a Dying Fetus/Suffocation tone.

If I could get something besides dial up, and had a working soundcard, I'd record a good sample and upload it. If you want to hear a really rough recording of it at a band practice, check out the link in my signature. Sounds better in person but u can hear it definitely does have distortion.

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well ihave the schematics and will just take it to a repairstore in boston
just waiting for an email response from them

Hey folks. I'm searching for manuals for my SS140C. I found this thread and had to post...

Your 1988ish Blueline amp obviously has a problem. It should get plenty gain and I have had mine for almost 20 years and I've never had to run it over 5 on the dirty channel (A). It's a little fuzzy at low volumes but... Lack of gain should not be a problem with this amp. First take it to someone who is insured and get it fixed right. The clean channel is not great but decent, the chorus and reverb help but it never has really had me saying "YES that is the clean sound I want", I'm satisfied but not real impressed with the clean sound.

The amp by itself is a little thin on the tone so I bought myself a bass EQ pedal for some extra control on the low end through the front effects loop. I have been running this through a Holmes 4x12 cab with 2 different wiring configs. Mostly with the speakers in the cab wired in series parrallel to get 8 ohms. Straight out of 1 jack on the dry side (I have never really used the chorus much). It sounds good like this but I added a Marshall 4x12 a while back and the difference with it running stereo made me tear up and thank God I bought this amp (the chorus was great too).

Recently I rewired my cabinet. Since I'm not running the full stack any more (sold my Marshall to buy a PA) I disconnected the through jack on the cab and rewired it as a second input. I'm now running 2 of the 4 speakers on each channel at 4 ohms per side. This Amp still sounds awesome after nearly 20 years and the chorus sounds like chorus instead of an old broken tremolo effect. Not the best chorus but decent.

I also ported my Holmes cab to let it throw a little air and man this rig has a serious bottom end when I want it. It has the best sounding crunch I've ever heard in a solid state amp. The lows thump hard. I had to laugh a little when I pulled up a slip of paper that was in the back of the head with my settings written on it (from around when I first bought it). The settings I'm using on the amp and the Bass EQ are still the exact same after all these years.

Now I'm kind of a simple guy so I like simple but top of the line sound, this amp has it, it just needs a little coaxing to get it out. I play all original stuff but we range from death metal to popcore stuff with everything in between and I'm a big fan of heavy, crunchy guitars (I'm 36). I've watched the guys and gals I've played with over the years go through amp after amp after preamp after effects processor and on and on and I've never heard anything that made me even think about replacing my blue baby. That said, I did play with 2 other people over the years who had similar amps. A girl I jammed with had the newer version of the SS140C and a guy I jammed with bought an SS150 because he loved my amp so much. Neither of them could get the same sound that I get. We even tried the Bass EQ through their rigs and they just didn't have the bawls mine does. way more fuzz and way less bottom. I have no idea why??? (I suspect unspecified design changes???)

Be patient and make sure you get it fixed right and if it's one of the good ones you should be able to make it rip the flesh right off of whoever you aim it at (heheheh). Just don't crank it to 11 (and these amps really do go to 11, count the dots, there are no numbers just 11 dots). My Bass EQ adds a liitle gain so it boosts the volume a bit but I have never had to turn it up past 5.5. I'm afraid I would blow the windows out of where ever I may be and maybe the neighbors too.

Good luck!

Hey - I know this is an old, dead thread, but I am hoping some of you are still active on here and can help me out. My SS-140 is starting to get a strange channel bleed and I want to take it to my repair guy. Do any of you still have the schematic and if so, is it possible to get it emailed to me? Thanks so much in advance!