does any1 know if it is possible to install a kahler tremolo into a guitar which already has a Floyd Rose Tremolo??? Will I come across problems when doing this??? plz let me know...

Kahler makes a thingy that allows Kahlers to be used with Floyd-routed guitars. Check their site.

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Just my opinion, but why would you switch a Floyd for a Kahler?

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Yeah I did that with a Peavey I have, and it worked fine. You have to take a bit of wood out of the floyd hole first, but it will work.

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i wanted to switch to kahler because of the option of installing the strings without cutting off the ball ends... i was also looking at the edge pro III, but couldnt find a site where they sell them seperately... the floyd is just too high maintenance!!! Ive already stripped the cavity mount screws (screw that holds each individual string down to the bridge), bent the low E strings tightening screw, and chipped off a piece of the nut!!! its really starting to piss me off!!! lol...

Dude, you must be very rough with your hardware. You should never need to over tighten nuts/screws.

Geez, sometime I think Floyd Rose should include a free torque wrench with each bridge...

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I never had a Kahler yet, but I read on the site that it has 6 way adjustability, so it can adapt to any fretboard radius and string spacing, while a Floyd is optimized for certain preset raiduses and string spacings. That why I plan on going with Kahler, plus its insane pull up range (+1 octave, WOW). Anybody know the divebomb range, how many half steps?
If you want a Kahler on a Floyd rose equipped axe, you have to but the Kahler "Fat Plate". IMO it looks ugly, but if you want the Kahler its a neccessary evil.

maybe it's because my floyd is a licensed floyd, not an original floyd... is the hardware on the original made from better metal or something??? Because those cavity screws strip very easily on my licensed floyd... i already stripped 3 trying to find my "sweet spot" for each individual string...

Yes, the original floyd is made of higher grade metal than most, if not all of the licensed floyds out there.
Try going Kahler if you can, just to see if you like it better.

I've never played a Kahler, but I hear they require wwwwaaaay more maintenence and are harder to tune up. I can do a full string change on a Floyd(original) in like 10 mins., and replacement parts are cheap and easy to find. Just gotta make sure you have a high quality Floyd like a Schaller, Original, or Pro.

The Pro series can be adapted for different fretboard radiuses with shims under the saddles, and it's made for closer string spacing so it can do everything the Kahler can. Except maybe save you some sustain, but if you have a trem guitar chances are you don't need 2 minutes of sustain...

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Wouldnt that snap your string?

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whahahah u dont know half what kindof bullshit that is

i own i kahler, i have it on my custom guitar, and i shose a kahler for al the grewat things i heard and read about it, and serious, the kahler is nowhere compared to OFR's of edge pro's

the sustain is better on a kahler, but the divebomb reach of a kahler is more like half (maybe even less) of what a floyd/edge pro can do, and believe me i know

so if u realy want extreme divebombs and a good whammy bar for whammy tricks, get a OFR or even better a edge pro, wich are even slightly better if ur into crazy whammybar tricks..

EDIT: !!! i speak from my own experience with all the mentioned tremolo's, so i know wtf im talking about

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As for the pull up range, I remember reading that somewhere in the KahlerUSA site that the cam can be pulled up enough to reach one octave higher. But for the divebombs, I couldnt find any info, thats why i was asking. k13m, just curious, how high are the saddles on your Kahler?

well i always have my action low, so i guess the saddles are to, my guitar is at the builders place to get tsome more changes onit (since its a custom).

i explained this in another thread (i think the ran thread) but, on a ofr or edge rpo, when you dive bomb, the string gets off the saddle, it becomes a raly floppy piece of elastic (if u know what i mean) wioch maked the divebomb so extremely low.

on akahler bridge, the strign stays in the asddle, but thers only a small bit that actualy moves on a kahler, where a ofr of edge completele moves when u pullup, divedown. get what im saying??

doing a divebomb on a kahler wont get the string to get realy loose, and therefore not get realy impressive divebombs, seriously, it sucks..

ill find the other thing i sayd about kahlers and edit it in this post..comign son

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erad this page startign from my post, i explained quite alot about kahler bridges compared to floyds and edge pro's when it goes to whammy tricks and divebombs

http://metaltabs.com/forum/showthre...&page=163&pp=20

im saying all this cuz im realy REALT dissapointed about the kahler (mine is a 2315 i think), and trusting all the good things ive heard and read about them wich made me get one, i wish i went for the edge pro bridge of even a ofr

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I was reading up about Kahler trems on the Moser forum and Neal was saying how the saddles are supposed to be set somewhat high and the neck angle has to be adjusted accordingly so the action can still be low.



Yes, I do understand what you are saying about the strings and saddles. That sucks, I really like pushing the bar all the way down and get sounds like the end of the world is nearing. How high(an octave??) can a reccessed floyd raise the pitch?(I dont have a Floyd on my guitars, I use the ones at Sam Ash all the time though)
Damn, now I have to reconsider getting the Kahler trem. I love doing deep dive bombs and those high pitched wails with the trems. I'm gonna check out the Pro series Floyds that Soeru mentioned that are adjustable like the Kahler and see whats up with that. Thanks for the heads up though.

No clue,I never tried it since I dont have a Kahler, I just saw that on the Kahler site.

i doubt any trem can pull up 1 octave, cuz that a frikking lot, unles su play with 09's inB it wont realy work without breakign strings, but serious, a original floyd will do great for divebombs and high squeels IMO

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oh, alright. Have you ever tried out the Floyd Rose Pro? Is that any good?


EDIT: What fretboard radius and string spacing do you use with your Floyds?

I doubt most people would know that.

Except that most Floyds will have a standard F spacing.

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ive never tryd a floyd rose pro.
i currently just have a guitar with a kahler

fretboard radius depends on the guitar, or even brand of the guitar.

most fenders have a 10'' radius
most ibanez 14''
most jacksons 14 to 16''

then again, not ever jackson or ibanez wil have this radius.

im not eraly sure if u can change the saddles sepperate from each other on a floyd, wich u can on most strat style bridges, so i dno if u can make the saddles match the fingerboard radius.

i have no idea whats tring spacing my old jackson usa1 had, i dotn even know if they have alot of choice between them, they probaly have 2 dirrents spacings available i guess.

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so where can i go to buy an edge pro???

They come standard on some of Ibanez's guitars(Rg prestige series, i think)

ummm, ok... but i was wanting to buy one to replace my floyd rose, remember??? can i buy it without buying the guitar along with it???

http://www.ibanezrules.com/parts.htm

As for the Kahler being able to dump the strings, it can be done, just adjust the fine tuner portion of the bridge. You can set the pull of the bar so that it mimics what a Floyd can do. I have mine set so I can pull up maybe +1/3-1/2 and octave, and the strings dump completely off the board.
Kahler's work by somewhat changing the length of the string in relation to the bridge(rollers). The scale length stays constant, nut to roller bridge. Think of the string between the roller and ball end hook as surplus string to use for the tremolo effect. On a Floyd type tremolo, the actual scale length changes because you are changing the actual placement of the saddles when you use the tremolo. There is no "surplus" string to add into the equation when using this type of tremolo.(Note: I am only using the term "surplus string" as a generic way to describe how a Kahler works.)

Whoever it was that said changing strings on a guitar using the Kahler tremolo system is misinformed. Changing strings on such a guitar should take no more time then on a standard TOM bridged guitar, save for fine tuning and locking the string.

EDIT: JS1Guitar, to swap out your tremolo, you will have to make sure that the tremolo you are replacing yours with must have the exact pivot post spacing or else it will be a drop in replacement. If you cannot do a drop in replacement(Ibanez Edges and FR types use different mounting spacing), you will have to gently pull out the threaded bushings, glue in a dowel in the hole, cut flush to the body, and then re-mark where the new posts will go and re-drill. Unless you know what you are doing and have the correct tools to do this mod, then please take your guitar and new tremolo to a guitar tech.

Another tremolo you might want to look at is the Schecter Floyd type tremolo. IIRC these will drop in directly. They are high quality Steel tremolos. Schecter I believe makes the bases for the OFR. END EDIT

Like Kahler bridges or not, they do last longer and are more stable than Floyds. Everyone sets a guitar up differently. I love Kahler bridges. I have had guitars with neck/body angles and guitars without. Both with Kahlers and I get very loose strings on dives without an angled neck ( almost to the point the strings about fall off the saddles ).

I have used, setup, and repaired Kahler bridges for over 10 years and I have never had any major problem ( other than finding parts back when they were not being made any longer ). I've seen Floyds fuck up and end live shows though. Kahlars have a huge amount of range when diving and pulling up. More than enough to be dangerous and bust strings past +1 octive.

No offence K13m, but I think the cam on you kahler is maybe contacting wood somewhere. It may not be routed correctly. Both Floyd and Kahler have similer dive/pull up ranges ( both extremes being beyond practical use ).

Who cares anyway, both are fine bridges. Floyds just got more popular because they leased thier design and Kahler decided to maintain thier own quality design. I've always felt like Floyd sold out and I just hate the voodoo magic setup headache of cheap Floyds. Kahlers are so much easier to do everything on imo. A lot less wear too.

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nah mine is routed good and setup good, the only masterbuilder in holland build my guitar, and he has over 25 years experience building and repairing guitars.. ohwell whatever:P

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Now I'm really torn between which trem I'm gonna get... Now that I think about it, I'm gonna most likely get two guitars (probably custom) with similar specs, one with a Kahler 2315 trem and the other with a Floyd Rose Original or Pro and see which one I like better. Then any other custom guitars I get afterwards will get the trem I like better.