All thoes fags are overrated, and this is why:

http://www.marshallharrison.com/video.htm

http://www.bumblefoot.com/video/index.htm (Get guitars suck)

http://adam.fulara.com/e.php?g=music (download the Bach videos)

http://www.fabriziochiruzzi.com/Pages/news.html

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Great, well done, this definitely proves the stated artists to be homosexual.

You are smart, being that you missed the whole point.

For ImBored and others who can't grasp easy concepts.

All of the above listed guitarists are hailed as the greats, yet there are many many other guitarists who are far better, and they are not the end all be all of guitar players.

ImBored you must be clever since you didnt pick up on the fact I wasnt useing the term "gay" in the literal sense.

Shit, I'm not even trying to prove they are gay, that is clear, I'm proving they are overrated.

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Unless he was being sarcastic.

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this doesnt prove anything. if it were somthing original only paganini. then i would understand but it sounds like a bunch of rusty cooly wanna be's.though rusty plays faster. but yea after a while it is boring don't u think?
ohh ron thal is one of the greats that u are saying is over rated because most of the artists u mentiond were his influences

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Damn...

Nice post! Only watched a couple little clips (downloading other things). That dude, site owner, can fuckin play. He's all over the neck. I noticed he had a scalloped fretboard too. I'd like to play one of those.

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You just proved that there are players just as good if not better than the said players. Not everyone can be famous no matter how good they are. That doesn't make anyone overrated just lucky as hell.

Edit By the way those were awesome vids. thanks for posting them.

Dude, what that marshall guy is doing is so childish its not even funny. His vibrato is probably his worst aspect, his phrasing is terrible, and very little dynamic control. Not to mention when he finally decides to go slow, hes not playing well with the music.

Seriously do you even know why Satriani, Malmsteen, Vai and all those people are where they are and why they are so good? You do realize there are about a million people that can play super fast, but thats what impresses people the most about all those people. I am going to go see the other videos, but thats as far as i am now.

Meh, gutrie govan and bumblefoot have impressed me before, but everything in that video was pretty stupid. . .to me. I know people can play that fast and i dont need to hear it constantly and with the noises going on it was pretty retarded. But thats just me.


That Fulara guy was pretty cool. I came with an idea of harmonizing on the same guitar with two hand tapping, and i thought i was pretty unique, but i guess its already been done. But i was most suprised about him, is that he seemed to have some dynamic control there, but still you can only have so much with tapping. I think he was the best of them all in individuality.

Fabrizio is ok, i think if he put his head in a little different direction he would be much better, but he seemed to do alot of meaningless running around, which bored me in about 10 seconds. If he started phrasing a little better and really digging in to his playing, then he would be alot better in my book.

I notice in this forum that all the new artists shown in threads tend to all be people who just shred meaninglessly and have terrible vibrato. Seriously, is anybody tired of it yet? I mean if you sit there and think about it more and more, you will see why straight up shredding is retarded. All those people are the ones who give shredding a bad name, cause theres nothing wrong with a little shred here or there.

That Fulara guy looks like Rowan Atkinson on crack. But damn that's neat. What's up with the duct tape on the fretboard? And what's the name of the dude with the blue Ibanez in that long live video? Though Fulura is more impressive I like how that other dude plays more. Technicality isn't everything sometimes...

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U are an absolute retard

wow there are other guitarists besides the big names who can play well Holy Shit i never would have known if u hadnt pointed that out to me.

to many ppl see speed as the defining criteria of a good guitarist, why becasue its the easiest part to achieve, oh wow i can do a B Aeolian scale at a rediculasly fast BPM, fantastic but its still just a scale and no matter how fast will never sound like anything else u put that in music u have a guitar excerise CD not a song, playing musicaly is the realy hard part, then puting those together. Speed and actual Musicality

Just because there other people out there who can play well and proficiently doesnt mean that ppl like Vai, Statch etc suc and it doesnt make them any less deserving of there status. There are many reasons besides just being bloody excelent musos (i wont speak for all u mentioned cause i dont personaly hold masive opion of players such a yngwie) that these guys are so revered they were the ones who started or at least popularised many of the techniques its soo easy for players now to just follow in the footsteps of these great artists but the hardest thingis doing something new something orginal.

there are many great artists out there and some of them may not get the recognition they deserve but when u say that ppl such as Satch and Vai suc because of it i think thats a bloody stupid statement and an one of the hugest overeactions ever. there are far greater injustices in the world dude stop being a dick and wake up.

wtf is the point of this thread? This is a waste of my english, idiots.

This is thread was made just to prove that a few guitarist are overrated. Who gives a damn? Even worse we have blatant waste of human sperm whining about vibrato and playing fast. Although I will agree shredding can get quite annoying. But do you know what I do when I get tired of it? I stop listening stupid asses.

Has it ever occured to you that these musicians shred because that's what they like and it just so happens that other people like it to. If you don't like it don't go shitting all over their name and just turn it off. If you can do better make your own music and quit whining and wasting space on this site.

edited-every post in this thread should be deleted except for the vids and then lock it.

I am a dumbass. I do not understand the link between homosexuality and Yngwie/Muhammed/Vai/Satch, coming from those links, or any other places I have seen them/their work(s). Please elaborate.

yeah this post is definately pissing me off...

Are you also saying that any guitarists that can't play better than or as good as Muhammed/Vai etc. are "gay" as well?

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so what, your saying that everyone with less talent than those people are gay...?
so does that apply to you aswell, because im sure your not as good as muhammed, vai, satch etc.

even though im not really impressed with mo's skill, he has talent, and just because there are better guitarists than him, it doesnt diminish the fact that hes good on guitar.

you could be fast as shit, but you still may not be able to write music to save your life. those people are popular because they can make good music which appeals to alot of people whilst still being challenging, inspiring and fun to play.

My guess is that Dead prob didn't really mean vai and muhammed are gay or suck. I think he just put that for a catchy thread topic to stress the fact that others our there have the ability to be as good and you've never heard of em. Just my guess....

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Uhh yeah i think your the one being a stupid ass. Thats fine thats what they like, and yes these guys are good at it, but its obvious that the whole genre of shred has become corrupt. I mean Jesus, Jason Becker was amazing as everyone can agree because he can play very fast and would use it effectively. But why do you think he so popular? Hes an excellent song writer, has excellent feel, excellent dynamics, excellent VIBRATO (and seriously, your a dumbass already if you think vibrato isnt important, which seems to be the majority), excellent phrasing, etc. . . Shred is great, but not what the modern shredders are turning it into. They are millions of miles away from people like Becker, Friedman, Holdsworth, Petrucci, Vai, Satch, etc. . .

I understand this guy is trying to say, yes there are good guitarists besides the big names, which is true, but ill be the first to say, its not these guys. They are slowly moving farther and farther away from calling the guitar a musical instrument. Jimi Hendrix is a perfect example again. He has all the same stuff i said about Becker, but according to you, cause these guys can play fast but lack all those other qualities still must be better. Seriously think about what your saying.

i know what you're trying to say but i think alot of people already knew about alot of other talented guitarists. Bumblefoot is good, Fulara was very unique and the last guy had a decent sense of melody. Cant help but feel you're sort of kicking a dead horse with this, though.

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y are peeple to serious nowadays?? geez

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I can't download the videos. Did he post a bunch of videos of Yngwie, Suicmez, Vai, and Satriani all having a gay orgy? That would be cool and all, but why in the guitar forum? We have a forum clearly marked for calling people gay.

Chit chat?

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I understand what your trying to say. Song writing vibrato and phrasing are extremely important in writing good songs. What I'm trying to get across is that bashing on another persons skill and calling them childish is not helping anything. Your senseless complaining won't help to change anything. If you really cared you could try some constructive criticism instead of calling them dumb and whining on about how bad they are. That's what I'm getting at. Otherwise as far as shred becoming tasteless and just about speed. I somewhat agree with you there.

Cumwad

if you like this players
take a look into the website

worldguitarcontest.com

pretty much, if they had somthing original to show, maybe somthing melodic with some phrasing as well dynamics. and other techniques instead of full out sweeps. than maybe it would be enjoyable. the reason why people like satch is he thinks like a listener and plays the appropiate speed and dynamics to get out the emotion that he wants the listener to hear. its just like painting a certain stroke makes a certain emotion/color. but satch isnt afraid to mess around with his ideas. i mean could u actually listen to shred for over an hour and not get bored, well it depends on who u listen to if its jason becker. than thats differnt cuz all his stuff is the shit

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Ok, now i see what you mean, i think i took the tone the way i did and the way i put the criticism across was because of how the person who started this thread. I would have not worded it the same if he was just like "these guys are pretty good guitarists, and in my opinion, better than vai, satch, blah blah". But he didnt, he called them gay, and decided to make these other guys his idols. What i was saying is fine, its not like these guys know about this forum or read it, so its not like they are going to take my criticisms to heart, so thats why my reply was open to bash them. I was arguing with the kid and giving reasons why HE is the idiot for thinking the way he thought.

Really, he can say whatever he wants, and argue with me, but it is a FACT: none of those guys are on the level of people like Vai, Satch, Becker, Holdsworth, etc. nor do they have the same mindset or views of music.

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fuck. steve vai is and always will be my favorite guitarist. i dont give a shit if theres someone out there who can shred better or whateverthefuck. i love him for his talent not only in ripping the fuck outta his guitar, but for his songwriting and composing and overal musical ability. like take that francesco ferarri guy. he sucked balls cause he couldnt write shit but could shred. steve does both. all fucking hail steve vai. satch is pretty cool himself.

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Ok we agree. Well if I were you I'd atleast try to email them or something with advice just to say you tried even though most likely they won't listen or care. After that commence the bashing. But I would always try to offer constructive criticism first.

they all forget.Technique is worthless if its not true music.Why is Hendrix so awesome?????

As many cool Bach pieces you can play,its still not what you wanna hear from a guitar,thats why it was written for harpsichord,if you can play the cminor prelude,fuckin cool,great music,but if you can make it sound like a guitar playing those notes,not just plucked(or tapped)notes,youre just emulating and "reading" notes,because to me,guitar needs not only dynamics,virtuosism and rhytrhmic but also an overall voicing that gives the guitar "life".

Who gets this?????

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I do, I said similar on my Vai rant. he's talented cause its good music and songwriting. not just shredding. like i said. im behind ya, man

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Mick from slipknot owns Vai.

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oh yeah,so does his third cousin in law once removed from the family.You know,the one with the club foot eye patch funguar disease on fingers and arthritis

Oh and Newhell,I get you but let me strengthen ourt point of view.besides songwriting,even if you play a cover,youre good not only by perfecting it exactly as recorded,but giving it your own mood,dimensions and just breath.

Again another comparison with painting,The best painters and the ones considered to really be gifted weren't doing perfect portraits of the body,landscapes or anything.they could do it,but art and paint meant to them more than physical perfection.It was the spiritual perception that Picasso's oddly figured shapes and polygons made him state his thoughts and soul,which is really hard on music,to make a true voice and not just a pretty painting.

PS But I also understand that some find beauty in extreme speed and "reality"(painting analogy)and thats how some take out their feelings.I do too,but just cause Im not very good at any other forms.

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DiveBombs = Good Guitarists.

Period.

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Don't forget Upbombs!

Those videos disappoint, I was expecting at least one big handle bar moustache, a gimp mask, a member of my family or at least a Rob Halford esq studded cap! But no, just people noodling on guitars

Mind you that Adam Fulara is doing some ceeeeerrrrraaaaazzzzyyyyy shit, I quiet like that! He looks like Geddy Lee and pulls faces like he's gonna spunk in his pants(in his own pants not Geddy Lee's)

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I don't even like Joe Satriani, but this post hits the nail into the coffin

No matter how good a guitarist, if you want to base it on technicality, even a semi-advanced pianist could probably upstage them. That's why it's also about expoliting the unique aspects of guitar that make players good or bad, as well as there compatability with a band. Most of these mpg-masters have horrible neck tone and mindlessly shred to a spasticated drum loop, Francesco Faerari is a prime example of this. you think they're great until you hear more than one in song in a row by them.

You are all brilliant.

I'm not talking about song writing cockbags because that is pointless. Judging song wrtiting is personal and varies from person to person. My point is that thoes people I listed are considered the end all be all of shredders. Count how many fucking times you have seen someone say something to teh effect of "OMG muhammed plays teh most tech sweeps ever, i dont know how he plays so clean!!!" When really it isnt all that hard to get good at sweping a minor arpeggio when you ahev been playinga decent amount of time. Or how many people hair Malmsteen as a guitar god. I'm talking sole technical ability because there is no accounting for taste. Obviously you are all missing that point since all I hear is "WAHHHH VAI CAN WRITE EMOTIONAL SONGS!". Maybe I think Vai can't write a song to save his life, but it doesnt matter because arguing about songwriting is dumb because of what I have said before, ther eis no accounting for taste.

Honestly if you can't grasp the idea that all I'm syaing is that the guitar players teh majority of people hail as super elite shredders would get bent over and sodomized by these guys.

And again, whatever dumb ass said something like "oh well you must be gay because you can't play as good as Malmsteen.", you're fucking stupid. Turn around and look up because the point of this thread went way over your head.

Hehe, whats funny is everyone is bitching about song writing when all the Marshall Harrison videos are classical pieces. Yesh, thoes guys couldnt write songs at all. Well I did learn something new today, guitar noodling = classical guitar.

Honestly, where the hell did I mention anything about them being better song writers?

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Minus the spelling errors, Amen. (I'm in English class right now so I have to be a dick about spelling.)

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You obviously don't know much about the guitar if you think Muhammed is in any way similar to Yngwie Vai or Satch. Especially since the other ones you linked are all the same as Yngwie anyway. lol at this prick trying to think he knows more than everyone else.

I wasnt talking style, dumbass. I was speaking simply in terms of popularity and blind love of the guitarists.

You clearly know nothing about music if you think Malmsteen's 3 string arpeggios and harmonic minor jerk-off fests are the same as Paganini, Bach, and Wieniawski. Congrats on not knowing what youre talking about!

lolololololololololoololololololololol

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I think this thread was kinda a bad idea, not because what dead is saying has to be wrong ( I don`t really have an opinoin on this), but it was bound to piss so many people off, especially with that tittle.

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agreed. my fav vai song is liberty, whispering a prayer, fuck yourself(very funny), or the animal

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jesus i almost cryed reading that

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Wow what a fucking idiot.....

1. How in any way does it show Marshall Harrison's ability to make a song by playing music that others have written that are advanced? The bitching of his song writing still stands since the song writing was done by brilliant composers who would think us idiots that this sort of shred you posted is anywhere near good music, not Marshall.

2. You actually can argue who is a better song writer. I think i have said this many times, but basically when you get advanced in music, (which many of us are not on a very high level if not none of us,) you can still not like a song but still know that it takes a very good song writer to write it. There are certain aspects of a song and songwriting techniques that can be employed in creative ways, and despite you not liking it at times, its still advanced and that person would be characterized as an accomplished song writer.

This, my friends, is why the most advanced music in the world is often under-appreciated. Ashlee Simpson is making money and Allan Holdsworth isn't. Pretty much everyone on this forum appreciates more advanced music cause you play an instrument, have some understanding of music, and have a aquired an ear for it. But even we are guilty of promoting low-level music with this shred stuff that you have posted.

PS If you say that these guys make Vai, Satch, Malmsteen, etc look gay, then why don't you specify and say "In technicality" and not stir up all this trouble? That is why you are the dumbass, not us.

Exactly.



Santana is better than all.No matter how fast,bet you Adam Fullara wont play Europa as MEANINGFULLY as the man himself,or someone that dedicates to make guitar alive,not a diarrhea-speed thing.Its fun,but back to back,which is more meaningful????

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adam fulara is incredible i showed to a friend who plays piano and he was in complete awe. Easily one of the best tappers i have ever heard except maybe

www.adriandavison.com

ok now eveyone STFU qwith the bullshit, its all opinion wise

goddamned

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lol idiot. Yngwie plays classical scales, copying those of Paganini, yet you says he doesn't have a similar style? They're all boring as fuck, especially Marshall Harrison. There's a reason why he's only slightly famous through videos of himself playing at home on a website - because he is fucking copying already unexciting pieces.
Classical music is good, playing it on the guitar is not. I hate Vai and Satch, but I have alot more respect for them than Bumblefoot and Marshall Harrison. They are very overrated yes, but at least they write their own music and are developing new sounds, instead of duplicating ones that are hundreds of years old.
It's not fucking about the shredding, there's probably thousands better than the wankers you posted. It's about the writing and creativity on the guitar, and that is why Muhammed is respected on here as much as he is.
Congrats on being an arrogant little bitch that still hasn't grown out of the "speed = best" phase!

lolololololololololoololololololololol

I don't necessarily see how saying that those guitarists are homosexual is inferring all the points you have stated in your posts. Perhaps you should think about what you write before posting.

Even if you are talking about sole-technical ability, and the guitarists whom you showed us are more technically able than that of Vai and Satch, etc, you can't ignore altogether the musical side of the guitar because that's the sole purpose of being able to play that technically good; to be better at musical expression.

People don't hail them as 'super elite shredders', they hail them as technically able guitarists who can write amazingly (cept for Yngwie....haha ing-wee) and that is why they are so popular.

So what? They're faster and better at playing a guitar. I don't care one bit.
Just don't go calling them 'gay' cause there are more technically better guitarists than them. I'd rather listen to a beginner who writes brilliantly than a shredder who plays at at ten billion bpm.

And don't go telling me about your post being about technicality and not song-writing. If you're ignoring song writing then you don't know anything about music.

dude hes not callign they gay as in homosexual, geez are peeps around here rilli that stupid, gay is a term, if i would call a dog thats walking funny gay, does it mean hes homosexual?? NO... so there aaaahhhhhh y am i even responding, hes not talking to me

im starting to wonder y peeps are so damn serious around here??

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the dutch peace maker

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lol, not rilli, sometimes i just cant stand the bullshit post peeps make cuz they take the word gay to serious, or they take a simple opinioun to serious, its a goddamn forum. anyway

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Again, good job on not knowing what youre talking about. Have you actually listened to Paganini? And From what I se, I'm not seeing much harmonic minor. But maybe I'm wrong, maybe you could point on specific scales and modes both Paganini and Malmsteen bopth use? Maybe some song examples but I guess I'm to stupid to see them.

But, than again the Locrian scale is used frequently in both Jazz and death metal, I guess they copy eachother right?

Now listen, I'm not syaing I don't enjoy great song writing, and I',m not syaing these guitarists are better OVERALL guitarists than alot of otehr stuff I listen to. what i'm syaing, for the 50th fucking time, is that people think the guys whos i mentioned are super tech shreddders, and they are NOT. THAT IS ALL I"M FUCKING SAYING. Yet you whinny fanboy bitches cry like girls with scrapped knees.

And Muhammed isnt creative. Knowing a minor arpeggio isnt fucking creative.



madtrixcerenzia, what the fuck are you rambling about? You qyoted a post where I kept trying to explain that this post isnt about song writing, so whatever, analyize song writing all you want I'M NOT FUCKING TALKING ABOUT IT HERE. Yet all of you retardeds are still saying "OMG VAI PLAYS WITH MORE ENMOTION AND WRITES BETTER SONG!" Maybe to you. Did you ever think different people get different things out of music?

One moe time, i'm going to say this: I NEVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT MARSHALL HARRISON BEING A SUPERIOR SONG WRITER, YOU FAGGOTS.

Haha this thread is awesome.

Hey Unholy Walter, shut the fuck up. You managed to say the same thing as everybody else, good fucking job!

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I knew it'd be a matter of time before I responded to this thread.


DEAD does have a point ... in terms of being technically advanced, there are some players who wipe their asses with anything on G3.

Now my input : There are different kinds of virtuosos. There are the virtuosos who break ground in the area of technique and mental command of the instrument, they MIGHT be people who have endorsements from Ibanez and Marshall, they MIGHT NOT be. An example of someone like that, to me, is Stanley Jordan, or any of the guys DEAD posted, like Marshall Harrison. We're talking about guys who could play anything you put in front of them, REGARDLESS of the quality of the song, whether they wrote it or not, and that's what many of those sort of players live for, for pushing the boundaries of the instrument.

The OTHER kind, the "I'm good enough at my instrument to serve my songwriting, which is something to be said for in itself" virtuoso, are the sorts who appear regularly in guitar endorsements, like Eric Johnson, the late Dimebag Darrel, or a prime example, Karl Sanders/Toler Wade. Nile writes some incredible music, with very memorable riffs ( to keep DEAD from jumping on me, I'll say that Spawn Of Possession writes very clear, distinct, and very musical death metal which is very worthy of note ) that put the instrumental adepts that Sanders and Wade are on display, what with the knuckle twistings riffs and blazing solos : Its great music that has great guitar playing. Granted, its not Andres Segovia, but its still great music, with great guitar playing, couple that with stage presence and personal charisma, and you get a signature Dunlop cry baby pedal and a spot on G3, and maybe your own guitar clinic, and Allan Holdsworth still rips it up at jazz bars to small gatherings.


DEAD has listed, in my opinion, the first kind of virtuoso that I specified, and he's saying that at what they do, their playing denounces any standing that Vai/Satch/Malmsteen/Petrucci/Laiho whomever has as dominants in the field of technical wizardry. Which is fine : Vai is incredible at what he does, Marshall Harrison is incredible at what he does. They are two different kinds of guitar players, and hardly any of you are seeing eye to eye on what makes a great guitar player ( which is also fine ), and I think DEAD is enjoying that

You guys are thinking that DEAD is saying that the players he's listed here, that he puts them in the 'second' class of virtuosi that I specified. Which is'nt true ...


To reitterate : He's saying that in terms of speed, finesse, and mastery of instrument, there are guys way better than those in our favourite bands or whatnot, even the mighty Suicmez. True, they might not have as unique a voice, might never write a record that changes the face of music and/or guitar, and it might piss you off to be told that someone you admire is 'gay' ... but DEAD knows this And you're all biting his bait.

whahaha the last 2 post before me are the bomb

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Ok dude, i didnt bitch about song writing again, you just said "Marshall is playing songs that are well written" trying to say our bash of song writing ability was stupid. Did you not say that? well all i said in reply is how does someone playing a well made song by someone else make them a good song writer?????? Thats the way you put it across, now i am willing to say it just might be a mistake in how you phrased it.

Second, this is the thing that has gotten everyone in heat. It IS DEAD's fault. In the very first post, you said those people who are admired by alot of people were gay because these other guys exist. Then when people started saying all this stuff about song writing and reasons why they werent gay, you called us all dumbasses saying you meant in 'technique'. Well good job specifying that in the first post. Now that you have explained yourself better, people understand where you are coming from, but before you make a bold statement like you did, try to be a little more detailed.

PS Doesn't the ability to portray emotion/vibrato/dynamics all fall under the category of 'technique'? Maybe you should have said your first statement "These guys all make Vai/Satch/Malmsteen/etc. look gay in their ability to play fast and boring with little theory and emotion" Then all of us would probably say, "yes DEAD, I agree".

hmmph, well if its a simply a matter of technique, i'm sure others could be found to trumph those four. Also, didn't just about EVERYONE know that there were people more technical then those four?

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I really agree with Dead here.

I think Marshall Harrison has some excellent technique, especially on the Weiniawski Paraphrase video. It actually inspired me to learn it. I've been playing it for about a year now, and am not quite as close as Marshall is.

Yngwie is the master appregio player, if guitars only had three strings.

Try this guy:

http://www.rustycooley.com/videos/improv_jemfest.wmv

http://www.rustycooley.com/videos/RustySolo8-1.wmv

ive seen those rusty cooley vids before, he ok, i get kinda boring after seeing him play, although he does play amazing. i think at those speeds he plays everything gets so alike, but i have that with most shredders rilli, ahwell

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Yeah ok, so i did kinda post the same things as others had said, but i was in a bad mood then..didnt really read all of the other posts haha.
I do see your point though i dont necessarily share the same opinion
And i dont generally like people saying the word 'gay' in an insulting way, cause thats just insulting the people who are actually gay.

The Fulara guy is the one that impressed me the most, cause its something new that i havent really seen before...cept what is that thing hes doing with his mouth?? hahaha

I dont know, its very true that this is all opinion based. All i know is we have something to learn from every other guitarist out there, i dont care their skill level, so take that chance when you get it.

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Than you should probably stop posting here.

John basicly nailed it. All I've been syaing is while most of you queers worship guys from type #2 as both top of the line in BOTH #1 and #2 I'm telling you guys from #2 would get raped if they set foot in or around guys from #1.

Congrats to everyone who couldnt understand the above concept without it being fucking spelled out like it was. This was alot of fun and provided me with to many real life laughs to count. I always knew people were super stuck up and gay about Malmsteen/muhammed ect. but I never actually had proof of how gay, untill now. Thank you.

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Woah woah, calm down a bit. I'm allowed to say that i dont like people saying 'gay' as an insult. Doesnt mean im going to go around telling people to stop saying it.

I did find it hard to understand the concept at first, yes. But who cares? Everyone thinks differently so theres bound to be people who need the assistance in getting whatever it is youre trying to put across.

I dont worship these people, nor do i think these people are the best at technicality. I already know there are people better at technicality than those 'greats' mentioned.

But the way i see it is like a sandwich.
Youve got the finely crafted and made bread (technicality) and whatever it is you want to stick in it (musicality and emotion stuff). and you cant really have them on their own.
And thats the way others think too, just without the crappy metaphorical business.

So yes, i do get what youre saying, but its not what is most important to me

Why mention him then? Songwriting = everything. Marshall Harrison isn't anywhere near the fastest or most technically advanced guitarist. Even Michael Angelo is faster, and he can write a tune too.

p.s. your little "joke" about how uptight people get isn't working a single bit - it's clear you're the most uptight person on this thread.

In short, i think DEAD is just obsessed with people who are super fast and is basing their level of guitar on that. You are blinded by this, and if you decide to get better at guitar you will just see how stupid it all is and why this thread is actually stupid. Personally i think you need to just go to like a nearby college and just like talk to a high level guitarist from there and listen to them too; not some local guitar shop guy cause half the time they really aren't as good as you think they are. That would make alot of people see the light.

i think this thread should be closed, it attracts hate and bad spirits onto our precious, peacefull greenscreen

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k13m is a peaceful drunk

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+3

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I`ll drink to that And so wil he, probably

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Marshall Harrison isn't anywhere near the fastest or most technically advanced guitarist.


You're crazy. I've been playing technical stuff for a hell of a long time, probably longer than a lot of the members here have even been living (I've been playing guitar for 22 years), and Marshall has some excellent technique. A lot better than a mojority of the people I've seen. So I wouldn't go as far as to say he's not "anywhere" near a technically advanced player. On the contrary, I think he is on the upper parts of the list.

I hate green.

Thank you. Someone who knows what they are talking about.

Oh and Micheal Angelo comes nowhere close to Marshall Harrison, at all.

Can whoever was btching about Marshall's phasing please explain what they mean by "phrasing" and give explaes of where it is poor and give an example of what good phrasing is or what Marshall should be doing? You may not agree with me but atleast i'm showing some proof of my claims.

Better yet, show me someone who hybrid picks half as good as him.

Finally, I'm not obsessed with fast guitar players. I'm obsessed with the fact that the majority of guitarists think the faggots I mentioned are technical gods, when they are not. This has NOTHING to do with my taste is music or guitar players. It is simply facts. Guitarist X is more technicaly advanced than Guitarist Y. Plain and fucking simple. I know it may be hard to admit that Muhammed's minor arpeggio jerk-off's are not the craziest thing ever, but suck it, and face it.

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Most people who know who Muhammed is know that he isn't as fast or technical as they come - people like him because he writes good music. You're not very perceptive, and just a plain idiot, for thinking he is hailed as much as he is because of his technicality.

"Thank you. Someone who knows what they are talking about.

Oh and Micheal Angelo comes nowhere close to Marshall Harrison, at all."

Umm. . .right


Yeah, his phrasing sucks ass. I was the one that bitched about it and you saying you dont know what phrasing is just proves further that your judgement of a guitarist isnt at a very high level for you to boldy to say what you did in the thread title.

Phrasing is a very hard subject to explain but i will try my best (If you remember Jason Becker's instructional, somebody asks him about it and he has alot of trouble replying so dont expect mine to be wonderful). Phrasing first is the ability to not just run around randomly and all the notes be of the same duration. Its more or less like making phrases, being little melodies, in the solo. Here is a good example to show you what i mean:

If a singer were to sing similiar to how Marshall and other shredders you love solo, how do you think it would sound? Even though the rhythm section will be playing the same rhythm usually (in a simple song) the singer will make up his own melodies along with the lyrics. How often do you hear a singer go up and down a scale in even 16ths along with the lyrics the entire time like you hear so many shred guitarists do when they solo? Never, cause it would sound stupid as it does when it is constantly done with a guitar.

Thats the best way i can explain it.

And goddamnit, your all idiots who think that technique is ALL in speed and clarity. Thats part of it, but so is vibrato/dynamics/intonation on bends/timing and rhythm/etc. Until you see how important those are and how important having knowledge is, you will never see or respect the truly good and talented guys.

PS Marshall cant stay in rhythm for shit on ANY of his improvisations. They sound like pure shit and your a dumbass to think that Vai, Satch, whoever isnt capable of doing ANY of the things posted. They just realize and know how stupid it is to aspire to do any of those things. I used to compete in piano till 6th grade, and played alot of of those Bach pieces, and it took me 10 minutes to get the whole first system of measures completed, clean and loud on the guitar.

When are you going to realize this shits childish? Try improvising over a jazz song, or play Giant Steps by Coltrane, WELL. There is NO ONE on this forum that can do that. Not one, and ill stand by it.

Try improvising over a jazz song, or play Giant Steps by Coltrane, WELL. There is NO ONE on this forum that can do that. Not one, and ill stand by it.

Improvising over a jazz song is one of the easier things to do, once an established repertoire of modes, classic jazz chord progressions, etc, are understood. Listen to Marshall's Pat Metheny Jams, he covers this, with TECHNIQUE. Are you an expert on Marshall, or are you automatically discrediting him because you saw ONE video and didn't like it.

Bottom line is this: DEAD's point is about the fact that there will always remain unknowns out there who are better, better than you, better than me, and better than all of our heros.

Oh yeah??

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First off what makes some one better more often is simple opinion , in my day you had the die hard Clapton lovers , Cream Era of course against the hendrix lovers , Look theyre both gifted , As is a million guys out there some of the best players are people we never even hear about.
how can you we say one guy is better than the other guy , what makes satriani better than Vai or vice versa or yngwie worse than steve morse .
Its all opinion , Unless some one outwardly is really bad , then its all subjective
, So in other words shut the fuck up already and realize that Zakk and DIme fucking own all your fag assed heroes.

That's not me, read the end of post above mine.

Oh sorry mate, threw me off a bit, use Quote next time

I can play John coltranes - Giant Steps, this baby helped me out a lot - http://www.heplaysjazz.btinternet.co.uk/giants.html, Click play when loaded..

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Yeah, there are people out there that are good, but not the people you guys say. And not only that, as you get better, you realize that everybody is on the same level, but are only different in their creativety.

And BULLSHIT to all of you who said that stuff about jazz. Yeah, its easy to play the melody, the chords; a little harder to play the melody in the highest voice of the chords. (I am sure this is what you are referring to when you say you can play it) But none of you guys can play it the way its supposed to be played. Jazz is almost completely about improv. If you think there's not degrees of improv, then your retarded. Go ahead and try playing giant steps for a jazz dude. You WILL make a fool of yourself. You guys are all making amateur opinions on this. You guys all say alot of things are opinionated, but you guys need to realize its TO A DEGREE.

And guys: MARSHALL IS NOT GOD. He sucks. He has potential to be good, but you have no reason to talk or even begin to believe you know what your saying if you think he compares to Vai and Holdsworth and others. He is terrible at improv and cant stay in rhythm or phrase for shit.

I saw a video of Marshall a couple of years ago. The Weiniawski paraphrase, and thought he had great technique. He does. No one is a guitar God. People that think there are guitar gods are people who daydream about being one themselves. Someone is always going to think that someone else who is phenomenal sucks. I've been around the block. I started studying jazz, chord inversions, tempo and key changes, a long time ago. It's not my cup of tea. I like technical harmony, mainly major third overtones and harmonizations. That is the stuff I like to play, therefore if I see or hear it, that's what I like. I don't like all of Marshall's stuff, but he's got impeccable technique. That I agree with. But I'm sure there's someone out there that might live in your hometown that no one has heard of that is better. That is the only thing that I believe for a fact. There is always someone better in something. I used to compete in martial arts, and believe me, there is always someone better. They might have a different fighting style, good technique, read opponents well, but it's all preference; what you like and what works for you.

QUOTE "And BULLSHIT to all of you who said that stuff about jazz. Yeah, its easy to play the melody, the chords; a little harder to play the melody in the highest voice of the chords. (I am sure this is what you are referring to when you say you can play it) But none of you guys can play it the way its supposed to be played. Jazz is almost completely about improv. If you think there's not degrees of improv, then your retarded. Go ahead and try playing giant steps for a jazz dude. You WILL make a fool of yourself. You guys are all making amateur opinions on this. You guys all say alot of things are opinionated, but you guys need to realize its TO A DEGREE."




And P.S. I've been playing guitar for 22 year, and went to Berklee College of Music, so I think I have some idea about what I'm talking about, and not an amateur opinion.

I also majored in theoretical physics, so I can also understand things TO A DEGREE.

I understand pharsing, I simply put it the way I did because people like to throw around words yet say nothing in an effort to prove a point, like you did. You failed to point out any specfics or show me the light of impeccable phrasing. And don't use Jason Becker as a cop-out, you don't need to be theory buff to be an amazing palyer.

Everyone is on the same level? What the fuck are you talking about. Again you ahev gone off rambling about creativity and songwriting, something which has no importance in this thread. This is a discussion solely about technical ability. Somthing I thought someone of average intelligence would be able pick up after 5 pages of the same replies why different fanboy bitches, and my consist replies trying explain this isnt about song writing.

BlackRoseImmortal, you are retarded. You have to be joking me that you don't see the flood of bullshit about Muhammed and how "technical" he is. And just shut up untill you can show me what modes, scales and song writing techniques Malmsteen copied from Paganini or Weiniawski. Please list songs. Thanks. That statement you made before strips any validity of you opinion. So go frolic amonst the other Muhammed lovers and remain in awe over his masterful use of the minor arpeggio, pedal tones, and neck-pickup homosexuality.

"You guys all say alot of things are opinionated, but you guys need to realize its TO A DEGREE."

Wow, good job of proving my point. That was my whole point this entire time. No matter what style of music you like or what you like in a guitar player, when dealing with sole technical capabilities, opinion doesnt matter.
And for a second time, show me someone who hybrid picks half as good as him.

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Dead, you must realize that things like emotion and phrasing and songwriting can't be impeccable, because those are opinionated, to a degree. Its not as cut in stone like measureing speed or whose the fastest.

Jaxadam, or whatever, if you went to Berklee and did well there, i think your opinion would be different. I mentioned this thread to two college professors, one is the chair of guitar, of a VERY good music college for jazz at Duquesne. I also told my teacher who went to Berklee and opened for Steve Vai. I am done argueing cause this is just going to keep on going, but they all agreed with me about just about everything, and i even showed my teacher the Marshall guy and he thought he looked like an idiot. . .cause he is. If you go all over his site, hes such a knock of allan holdsworth wannabe, makes terrible mistakes CONTINUOUSlY on the piano stuff, and has little or no musicality on the guitar. I will stand by it, and u won't change it.

PS You can play guitar for 22 years, and go to Berklee and still not be a good guitarist or have a good view of music. I am NOT saying this is you, but not ruling it out cause no Berklee grad would be talking like you are.

You know what they used to say about Steve Vai when he went to Berklee? That he would never amount to shit. I think that just about should sum it all up.

Not that he sucks, I like him, but that people can have vastly different opinions, and sometimes those opinions (like him never amounting to shit) will be proven otherwise (like having one of the most popular signature guitars and sell out tours).

I didn't graduate from Berklee, I changed majors (and colleges) and ended up getting my degree in Physics. I would rather AFFORD to play the guitar than starve trying. Making it in the music industry is a longshot, for anybody.

Sorry if you already think I don't know what I'm talking about, but this is all I have to say: I think that Marshall has good technique. That's my opinion, and I'm sorry if you don't agree with it.

QUOTE "PS You can play guitar for 22 years, and go to Berklee and still not be a good guitarist or have a good view of music. I am NOT saying this is you, but not ruling it out cause no Berklee grad would be talking like you are"

So, without even knowing me or ever hearing me play, you automatically think I suck? I actually think you'd probably enjoy a lot of the stuff I play. I'll even play you some Autumn Leaves if that will make you happy. And how is it that I'm talking that no Berklee grad would talk like? Because I'm saying that I think Marshall has good technique? I think Joe Stump has good technique, too (one of my teachers at Berklee) but I like Marshall's better.

You're more full of assumptions and insults than facts. And I think it's a pretty bold statement on ANY forum to bet your ass that someone can't play something blah blah blah. It sounds like you've got a lot to learn, and hopefully one day you'll learn it.

Well, I went to a local music college and all the professors agred with me.

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What did they agree with you on?


And i still bet what i said about Giant Steps. People are in their final years of college for jazz guitar and still can't play the piece CORRECT.

And you know what, i agree with you guys on one thing. I have been a little childish lately on my tone on my posts, so sorry for that.

Fact remains that Marshall has good speed and clarity (not on that Chopin Etude 1 for the piano though), but him not showing good rhythm, vibrato, and dynamics proves that his technique isnt all there because, although alot of people forget, those aspects are the most important part of technique.

The people at berklee hadn't adopted much else but jazz yet when he was there in the 70's, that comment was probably about his level on other styles of the guitar.

And Joe Stump teaching at Berklee is a joke. Hes good at what he does, but the reality of it is that hes gonna teach all the pure shredders, whereas the higher level students will be pursueing jazz. Its easy as hell to get to berklee and they have real low classes, so alot of people do go there, but still suck. (They still have very very high level classes too obviously)

Well, I'm glad to see that this is taking a turn for the better.

There's nothing wrong with appreciating the techniques you are mentioning. I also agree that vibrato, bends, etc. are an integral aspect to adding elements to the song.

And you're right, there are all walks of life at Berklee. One guy there didn't even notice that I had a Les Paul copy, he thought it was the real deal. He was like "wow, nice guitar..." Um, yeah. Got it for a hundred bucks. Here, you can have it. <hands guitar to astounded Berklee alumni> ...

So let's all agree on something: There are all different aspects of musics that WE OURSELVES are going to think are important. And WE are allowed to appreciate these things. We may even have our own personal heroes that do these things for us, but until next time, there's always going to be someone else out there that's better. Hell, it may even be me!

i kno im new to this forum shit n stuff but this sounds like 1 douchbag who posted a thread just to piss people and to start an argument.and it seemed to have worked with all these people bitching about whos better at what and why. Think we should all just calm the fuck down and share a couple rounds

wats wrong with kicking dead horses???

You,are a tool.

Why did you have to revive this thread. I was finally glad to see it die, now your just throwing gas back on the fire!!!

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honestly, fucking grave diggers