I dont understand any of this bullshit. all this scale memorizing and shit. its fucking stupid. Its like their making rules for guitar playing. i read some guy say that not knowing theory is like playing blind, and its not like that at all. if u play enough, u should understand your instrument perfectly without any of that. ive basically just memorized every note by sound rather than a stupid ass letter in some fucking book. its ridiculous how they make up all these rules and scales and shit for different types of music. is there really a point? just fucking play by ear and stop making guitar playing like fucking math class. assholes.

shut up.

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Wrong forum, wrong argument. You're 100% wrong, i'm sorry.

I totally agree. Theory helps "unlock the magic." Your not gonna be a suck ass player just cause you don't know theory, but knowing theory puts you one step ahead though. It's like... instead of having to figure out something on your own, theory tells you it. So it like saves SOOOOO much time it's unreal. But it's still a matter of personal preference, so good luck!

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Some people cant...bla bla bla

Damn....you're angry.

You Sir, are an idiot.

I have taught myself for a year, and i can feel that what's missing from my guitaring is the theory.

Try writing music without it, not very easy.

Try soloing with a band without theory

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well for a start u mong, with all the different scales they end up cover every combination of notes, if u actually look theres about 20 odd different scales,
plus even if you think u can do it bettr without learning theory, its going to take you like 100times longer to learn properly, where all you'l end up achieving is exactly the same but less, than you would if you learned theory

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Fuck theory. Theory is for people who can't learn things for themselves. Chuck Shuldiner used no theory ever. R.I.P. Chuck, corpses forever.

I can solo for hours, with no theory. Theory is something I learned myself, I know what being in key is, and I figured out the circle of fifths on my own. I just didn't have to pay some fag for lessons.

Theory takes the feeling out of the music, and you end up sounding mechnical. Their is no gut instinct, theory takes the rock and roll out of playing. When you play Death metal, do you rally give a shit if some faggot thinks it's "proper" or not? If you care about stupid shit like that, don't play Death metal. Opeth is the worst Death metal band I have ever heard, the use alot of theory. They just jack off on stage, no real presence, just a bunch of idiot Swedes who learned how to play properly. Those fucking fags.

Did Chuck ever use theory? Fuck no, he was too good for that pussy shit.

Corpses Forever

Death is what metal is about. Death....R.I.P. Chuck Schuldiner, your legend lives on.

AMEN.

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Why? Theory dates back dozens of centuries back. Why waste the your time and the experience of generations of musicians before you if you can profit from what they did for us? And theory doesn't tell us what we have to play, only how we play what we want. Besides, even tough Chuck admited not knowing, music theory covers 'that wich sounds pleasant'. Chuck didn't know theory, but indeed he did use it.



You figured out being in key and the circles of fifths? Good for you! Have a cookie! But seriously, if you use the CoF (not the band ) you use theory. Now way around it bud. And what does 'paying some fag' have to do to it? There's plenty of good books in the library, plenty of good sites on the topic. Why waste time to 'learn it yourself' when the end result is the same or better?




A good musician knows what feeling he want to put in, and uses the theory to make it happen for him.




Death metal? I tought you were nekro frostbitten kvlt black metal
"Proper" has nothing to do with using the circle of fifths, knowing how to harmonise.
Nevertheless, if you don't care about your audience (whatever it may be), you shouldn't stand on that stage annyway, just play at home alone.



I agree with you wholeheartily, except that Opeth is not death metal, and they don't use "proper" theory. In fact, Akerfelt's songwriting is highly un-conventional, in a scholar's perspective.



CUNT!

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Some people need theory, others don't. Some find it helpful, others don't. See spot run. See spot lick his own ass. See metaltabs not give a shit.
Angry Hobbit....

did u know that music theory is a class u can take in high school?

i still think the angry hobbit is a pissed off dick.. call us assholes..

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in the words of my father... "Learn the rules, then break them."
ive taken a liking to this saying, and that how i think of theory... if you want to be different, bend the scales and do stuff not instructed.

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its not hard to stay in key. u dont need theory to play solos. just listen to the note that u play and figure out how many frets u should slide or wut string to switch to by ear. its not very difficult to know exactly wut note to hit if u actually listen to wut ur playing

Music theory is a standardized terminology. It is a means of organizing the way you think in terms of music, and giving certain names to certain concepts within music. If you play music, and you can play a piece from start to finish correctly by memory, the same way every time, then you use music theory! You have memorized shapes and patterns, and you have memorized how they sound. But instead of calling them "harmonized minor scales in fourths" or "gmajv7 arpeggio", you call them "the riff that sounds like this, really dissonant" or "that one lick that sounds Wylde-ish". Your brain still functions the same way as someone who uses theory, cataloging information in an organized manner. If you actually want to be kvlt and not use music theory, then dislodge your hippocampus. Idiot.

did i say that? i dont think i did. i never implied that EVERYONE on metaltabs thought that. just quite a few.

well...... I can

youve only been playing for a year. of course there is somthing missing. wut do u expect? u have no experience at all.

i write music without theory. and its not difficult. and of course writing music is hard for u, youve only been playing for A FUCKING YEAR!!!

You can because you do use theory. If your brain did'nt categorize riffs you play somehow ( and music theory is just a standard means of categorizing sounds ), then you would'nt be able to play a song from beginning to end, simple as that. "I DON"T USE THEORYSZORZZ!!1!!1! -- " Yes you do. The difference between you and musicians who do use theory is that they use a categorization system that is in widespread use. AND THAT'S IT. Refer to my post, its the last one on the first page of this thread.

As can I very easily.
However some can't...so theory is a great tool in helping.

There are many things we dont all agree on in this world...but to bitch and moan about a CHOICE....is really dumb.

HIPPOCAMPUS!!! HAHAHAHAHA. wtf is a HIPPOCAMPUS. is that really a body part??? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

The overriding principle here is that IF YOU MEMORIZE A SONG/RIFF/LICK/WHATEVER, YOU USE THEORY. You use the "memory" part of your brain to do it. Your brain just uses different 'names' to classify sounds. You are woefully incorrect in saying you don't use theory.

You are dumber than I possibly could have imagined.

Is it even a body part ... well click on the link and you tell me.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hippocampus

im not really bitching about people who use it, im bitchin about the people that think everyone has to have it or theyll suck. its not true at all. memorizing a bunch of scales is not necessary, and neither is memorizing names of notes. just remember them by pitch. not a letter in a dumbass book.

I don't think anyone ever on these forums has said that you have to have it or you'll "suck". This whole thread was unwarranted, and I've made a point you just don't seem to want to acknowledge, and that's that everyone uses theory.

Technically...you are very correct John. But I think the Angry dude means something else...he can play by ear and is happy with that. Same for me...I dont know the diff between a C & D on paper....but can easily match most tunes I hear and want to play...without knowing any tech details about what I'm playing.

The BIGGER question is......why is he so angry?

haha

ok... wut does a vagina have to do with any of this at all?

how about u go disenlodge UR hippocampus. BITCH

that is exactly wut im trying to say. thank u. no more angry face

i understand your point, but your missing wut im trying to say. i guess i should have made it more clear

Dude....you pretty much just sealed your fate.
First of all....and you are going to get FLAMED hard on this one....that was a schematic of the BRAIN......not a females interior. You should have READ it instead of quickly looking at the lil diagram.
Second...you're too new to be throwing disrespect around so freely.
John is a great member here and was only trying to help out a little.
I'm glad I'm not your bud.

No, I understand "wut" you're trying to say. Disagreement is not due to a lack of articulation on your part ( that's a completely different and equally expansive subject ), but that you're saying ( in your jargon ) is "I don't use theory. I play by ear. You should give playing by ear a try, and eschew theory for a while. You might like the freedom so much that you discard the use of theory all together" is irrational due to intrinsic error. Listen :

First, you do use theory, because for the fourth time, you HAVE A MEMORY CENTER. Second, those who do use standardized theory DO play by ear, ALREADY. If you play music then using your ears is the first pre-requisite. Third, there are players who swear by music theory who can rip all over you. If you can disprove what I've said throughout my posts by actual logic and reasoning, without personal insults and comparing brain lobes to genitalia, then we'll continue. Otherwise, you'll just remain errant.

Are you proud that you don't use the correct grammar as well? You seem to have eschewed the theory behind language but I would hardly say you understand it and use it to it's fullest. Imagine how much more eloquant your prose could be if you just sat and learnt some grammar. Funny that, I wonder if there's an analogy at play here?

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go teach an english class if u want to bitch about grammar

Hahahahahahaha!!!! You missed the point exactly. I even spelt it out because I knew you wouldn't get it if I left the last sentence off.

It's the same fucking principle, you insipid rectum.

Oh, and here's another person who new jack shit about theory: Kurt Cobain.

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if a hippocampus is a brain lobe then y the fuck did you put links to porn sites on there???

And that's probably the analogy I was looking for ... linguistics. Your basis for understanding music in any way shape or fashion is much like the way you understand written/spoken language in any way shape or form. You're saying, "DON'T USE A LANGUAGE TO CONVERSE WITH MUSICIANS", basically.

HAHAHAHAHAHA. i think i have ADD. i read the first two sentences and lost interest. i guess i should read these better before i post.
fuck kurt cobain. he just didnt care about writing good music. it wasnt because he didnt use theory, he just had no skill.

insipid rectum, i got a kick out of that one.

I followed that exact link and saw ZERO porn.
I saw a diagram that I can easily imagine a young male seeing for 2 seconds and thinking it was some scientific schematic diagram of a females interior....but I knew what a hippocampus was when I was 12 so......LMAO

Give this guy any Suffocation song and I bet he couldn't improvise a solo over any of the riffs that sounds any better than Christian Vikernes taking a particularly virulent shit in a prison toilet.

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ya, we call this porn in america

i wish i had recording stuff on my computer so i could prove your point wrong.

I am in America you imbecile. I don't know anyone pathetic enough to call it porn.

it's not that hard to learn how to spell either

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This is still in the wrong forum. We have a whole forum dedicated to theory, yet you're all still infecting the guitar forum with this piss.

Ha, you said insipid rectum.

how long do you play guitar? do you play in a band? have you ever been on stage before? do you write songs? did you ever try to learn the theory... not just bullshitting i mean really tried it? means you practised theory as you practise guitar every day.




i know alot of people with basically the same opinion. although i never considered theory as useless you have to understand that playing guitar ... for the most of us ... is much more than just pulling some stupid strings on a goddamn piece of wood. its a lifestyle. usually you want to write your own songs. you want to be creative and i never said you couldn't without theory but in the end your not only a guitar player. youre a musician. and therefore you wanna know what youre doing. you want the best thing for your songs and from my experience i can tell you that everything you lern about music will bring you much further with your playing. therfore everything you skip while learning an instrument limits you.

now you say "ok but music theory has nothing to do with what i wannna do with my guitar playing" and i have to say youre absolutly wrong. music theroy is very important when playing an instrument because you learn what you do on the guitar when playing. not just playing you understand it. anf if you understand it you can control it. and no matter what style you wanna play control is the key. if you know what youre doing you will always sound better than not having a clue at all.

and your frustration just comes from that hell lotta work. if you wanna master your playing you have to work. and whats that all about? if going to school would rapidly increase my guitar skills ( which it deffenetly doesnt) i would go to school 8 hours a day until i die no matter if it sucks or not. you will allways be an average guitar player if you dont work hard besides all the fun. and if you dont wanna learn you shouldnt play guitar.

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u still missed wut im trying to say. u can be good without using memorzed scales and names for notes and all that. if u just learn to recognize pitch by ear none of that will matter because u will always know wut ur doing, even if u dont know what its called, therfore you can write wutever comes to your head.

when i clicked on ur link, i saw a close up shot of a woman pulling a neclace out of her vagina and people typing ''shove a dildo in ur pussy". if u dont call that porn, then u my friend are the idiot. not me. fucking pervert

this isnt english class so shut the fuck up

stop saying "wut" dude

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fuck u. ill say wutever the fuck i want to say

Well, you want to rage about how theory is bullshit and you don't need it to make music. A precise parallel is grammar and the English language: you need grammar in order to construct understandable English.

It's the same for music, you need at least a basic understanding of key signatures and time signatures in order to make the music understandable and not sound like a random conglomaration of notes. By hook or by crook - contrary to your own protestations - you have this understanding.

Besides, if theory isn't necessary then why has each and every composer who is considered a genius endeavoured to study it? Surely theory is beneath their considerable capabilities? And don't throw Chuck back as an example, he hasn't got anything on the likes of Mozart, Bach and Beethoven.

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ANGRYHOBBIT: I PLAY GUITAR WITHOUT THEORYZORZ!!!!!!!
Forum: You do?
ANGRYHOBBIT: YES!!! HAAAAARGH!! SCALEZ SUCKZZS TEH ASS!!!!
Forum: You can't play a riff without unconsiously using some theory
ANGRYHOBBIT: NOOOO!!!!!! I WILL PROVE IT CUNTS!! *plays random notes on guitar* SEE? I RULLEZORX!!
Forum: You just played an Aeolian scale.
ANGRYHOBBIT:.......... GHAAAAAH THEORY SUCKS!!

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okay than...

DIE YOU STUPID SHITSTAIN !!!!!!!!!!!!

Have a nice day

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fucking hipocrit. u spelled then wrong.

I know. I'm dutch. I don't know everything about english. I mainly focus on the dutch language

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then dont talk shit about my english, i can talk fine, im just too lazy to type correctly

I personally dont use theory. Why? To me its because Im a fucking retard and cant comprehend anything that I try to read. And in the less crude words of Jittery Sniper Id rather not pay someone to teach it to me. And I find I am lacking in my soloing. I am wondering what I am missing. I create solos for my band still yes this is true, you can do it without theory. BUT IT TAKES A FUCKING LONG TIME TO DO IT. My solos are not complicated and I would love to learn theory but im a lazy bum. So quit your fucking bitchin, If you dont like it then dont use it. If you think your music sounds good, play it. JUST DONT COME WHINING TO US WHEN YOU NEED A QUESTION ABOUT WHAT SOUNDS GOOD WHERE, OR WHERE SHOULD I PLAY THIS.

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take that dildo out of your ass dude

I just asked something. I wasn't giving you shit.


You have issues

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u STILL miss my point. what im trying to say is that i dont give a fuck about what stuff is called and and dont give a shit about memorizing scales. i didnt say you should play random notes that are off key. what im saying is that U DONT NEED TO HAVE ALL UR SCALES MEMORZED TO PLAY IN KEY!!!

if u can recognize pitches by ear then it doesnt take long at all.

It's that easy folks! Don't bother learning theory - you don't need it to stay in key! Fuck a thousand years of music theory, it's not been needed all this time!

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What pitches? How do you know you're in tune?

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wut do u mean wut pitches, the fucking notes u play idiot. and wut do u mean by HOW DO U KNOW UR IN TUNE? how can u not know. u can fucking tell when ur playing if ur in tune.

Pitches as in WHERE THE FUCK ON THE FRETBOARD and what note value they have. By in tune I meant HOW THE FUCK DO YOU KNOW WHAT TUNING YOUR GUITAR IS IN? How do you know you're in standard tuning without knowing some theory? Even tuning by ear you still need to know the intervals between strings.

It's like banging one's head against a brick wall, it really is.

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to me, theory is like religion. you can choose to belive that there is a porpose for it, or you can say that its just a bunch of made up bullshit. like Christianity

Choosing what you reply to now?

How do you know you're in standard tuning without knowing some theory? Even tuning by ear you still need to know the intervals between strings.

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By the way, that comparison of music theory and religion is the most laughable I have ever read. Music theory has real and practical applications and is entirely based on fact and science. Who needs theories based in science when we can just make it up as we go!

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One more chance to prove you're not a troll:

How do you know you're in standard tuning without knowing some theory? Even tuning by ear you still need to know the intervals between strings.

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yow...T1HS GUY 1S S0 BaDA55 H3 MaK3S Up H1S OwN GoDDaMN Tun1Ng !!!!111!!!!!

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maybe u need a free lesson? yes free.

just because you were watching porn before you clicked the link, doesn't mean the link was to a porn site.


I noticed, anyone who claims not to use theory are generally ignorant and arrogant.
Chuck, yeah he was awesome, but his solo's did get fucking repeatitive, and bland.

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Though I wasnt there...I seriously doubt this senario...you and I and John were all replying back and forth together...and I clicked that same link within seconds of you claiming it was a females anatomy.

Just admit you thought that diagram was a fems anatomy...backpeddling just exposes you to further ridicule.....not to mention your berating members with 12 yr old retorts of vulgarity.

Noone calls Johnmansley and idiot. Johnmansely could destroy you in anything knowlegable. Stop having a hissy fit. You sound like a 5 year old.

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Someone has a warlock headstock up their ass. Don't say stupid things. Just because you have given up trying to understand music theory, doesn't mean that you don't read it. It's nice that you know what each fret sounds like, but how are you going to write it down? Music theory isn't a set of rules, it's all guidelines.

Angry Hobbit has inspired me to learn guitar theory. So I can get away from his likeness as far as possible.

same.I want to learn it anyway though.

Listen Angry Hobbit guy, theory is important. All the famous classical artists used it. If not all of it, then to some degree. Theory helps you write your music down, and also helps your improvisation skills. You're arguements make no sense at all.

Let me put it like this:

You don't HAVE to learn to read or write, because people will still understand you when you talk, right? Right?

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i say theory is a forien language,a gateway drug,a science, and math.
a foreign language because after using it for a while u know what the hell u are doing/ saying.
its a gateway drug because it opens your true potential inside to express yourself without sounding like a dumb ignorant fuck.
its a science becuase it deals with decibals and is very complex, and it uses formulas, if u think about it.

For me it feels like fort knox (A gold depository in US for those who dont know) when you try to get in, you have a whole bunch of fucks saying, "No admittance asshole get the fuck out ya fuckin hippie......................."

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HOLY SHIT!!! I LIVE BY FT.KNOX, the town just outside it, real shit hole called radcliff

Thats amazing I live near chicago in a rich suburban arean filled with harcore faggots and weekend warriors. I will put it as my forefathers have put it. Nice place, shitty people

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whats it called?

Mount Prospect/Arlington Heights - even the name spells out gayness.

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never heard of it... yea thats true about it being gay.

I have been through many parts of Kentucky all of my life traveling from here to Illinois.
I remember seeing a town called Bonelick and always though it humorous as a child.
It was just outside of the Corvette town I believe.

Yeah, me too...