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  #81  
Old 2007-04-11, 21:47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pr0az
Ok during these period Pst with Beethoven, Vivaldi, and Bach there were no copyright laws. Back during those times it was actually considered praise if someone stole your music and so forth and used it in one of their pieces. Therefore being so old and no laws existing at the time its perfectly legal, and besides who in hell would the copyrighted work belong to?



No you retard. You need to look into how things become public domain. There are beatles songs if i'm not mistaken now that are public domain (or at least they were talking about beatles songs and elvis songs). Generally in music it has occured after time has passed and the songs have been incorporated into the culture. I believe patents expire after 20 years although you can get extensions.(which most do) and there are alot that are going up in smoke as a result.

And response to your second paragraph. PST is right. The entire case is proving that a tab is something that was copied. They will have to argue that by ear transcribing a song its actually a copy of the song that was illegally made.

And refering to the drug industry, that IS true. I've heard it from my chem professor who works at the patent office in DC dealing with patents from drug companies. That is one insanely ruthlessly tough business i tell you what. (getting a patent for a drug)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darko
...Its very annoying to keep having to hear some socially-disabled teen come on these boards talking about all the drugs he's started doing so that he can maybe grasp onto some kind of positive response so he feels better about himself and what he's doing.
About requiem. Aint it the truth...

Last edited by tmfreak : 2007-04-11 at 21:51.
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  #82  
Old 2007-04-11, 21:51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmfreak
No you retard. You need to look into how things become public domain. There are beatles songs if i'm not mistaken now that are public domain (or at least they were talking about beatles songs and elvis songs). It occurs after time has passed and the songs have been incorporated into the culture. Where the songs or intellectual work has played a significant enough role on society. Also patents expire after 50 years, and there are alot that are going up in smoke as a result.

And response to your second paragraph. PST is right. The entire case is proving that a tab is something that was copied. They will have to argue that by ear transcribing a song its actually a copy of the song that was illegally made.

And refering to the drug industry, that IS true. I've heard it from my chem professor who works at the patent office in DC dealing with patents from drug companies. That is one insanely ruthlessly tough business i tell you what. (getting a patent for a drug)


dude your an idiot fucking read your history book about the time of fucking BEETHOVEN! there were no copyright laws ughhhh thats all i was talking about this is way before people new what public domain was...

dude they ARE COPYING TABS WTF? i mean we just cannot make the law fit our little nest egg.
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  #83  
Old 2007-04-11, 21:52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pr0az
dude your an idiot fucking read your history book about the time of fucking BEETHOVEN! there were no copyright laws ughhhh thats all i was talking about this is way before people new what public domain was...

dude they ARE COPYING TABS WTF? i mean we just cannot make the law fit our little nest egg.

No shit. But that has nothing to do with WHY something is public domain.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darko
...Its very annoying to keep having to hear some socially-disabled teen come on these boards talking about all the drugs he's started doing so that he can maybe grasp onto some kind of positive response so he feels better about himself and what he's doing.
About requiem. Aint it the truth...

Last edited by tmfreak : 2007-04-11 at 21:56.
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  #84  
Old 2007-04-11, 21:56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmfreak
No shit. But that has nothing to do with WHY its public domain.


THAT IS WHY IT HAS BEEN PUBLIC DOMAIN! Untill they made the fucking law people didn't no what public domain was. All those guys stuff has always been free to use with no problems. I never mentioned new shit from this day in age like you mentioned the "Beatles"
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  #85  
Old 2007-04-11, 21:57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pr0az
THAT IS WHY IT HAS BEEN PUBLIC DOMAIN! Untill they made the fucking law people didn't no what public domain was. All those guys stuff has always been free to use with no problems. I never mentioned new shit from this day in age like you mentioned the "Beatles"

We are both right but you are arguing something that has NO relievance to the case. It wasn't the fact that THEY are public domain as much as MUSIC can be public domain.

You're looking at it from the literal point of view, and thats not how it was intended.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darko
...Its very annoying to keep having to hear some socially-disabled teen come on these boards talking about all the drugs he's started doing so that he can maybe grasp onto some kind of positive response so he feels better about himself and what he's doing.
About requiem. Aint it the truth...
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  #86  
Old 2007-04-11, 22:00
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmfreak
We are both right but you are arguing something that has NO relievance to the case. It wasn't the fact that THEY are public domain as much as MUSIC can be public domain.


It has relievane to the discussion! Jesus Christ why must you persist? ASSHOLE!
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  #87  
Old 2007-04-11, 22:01
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pr0az
It has relievane to the discussion! Jesus Christ why must you persist? ASSHOLE!

No it doesn't. Tell me what production of something before 1923 has anything to do with internet tablature? It does not.

I withdraw what i said at first about public domain. That was more or less my observation of how intellectual works become public domain over time, but after doing a little looking around i found a page that spells it out a quite well.

Apparently this person at a UNC college did their homework.
http://www.unc.edu/~unclng/public-d.htm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darko
...Its very annoying to keep having to hear some socially-disabled teen come on these boards talking about all the drugs he's started doing so that he can maybe grasp onto some kind of positive response so he feels better about himself and what he's doing.
About requiem. Aint it the truth...
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  #88  
Old 2007-04-11, 22:02
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I was answering PST QUESTION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! On how and why ITS BEEN COPIED OVER THE YEARS SINCE THEIR TIME!
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  #89  
Old 2007-04-11, 22:04
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pr0az
I was answering PST QUESTION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! On how and why ITS BEEN COPIED OVER THE YEARS SINCE THEIR TIME!


PST never had a question. haha (at least one that wasn't rhetorical )
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darko
...Its very annoying to keep having to hear some socially-disabled teen come on these boards talking about all the drugs he's started doing so that he can maybe grasp onto some kind of positive response so he feels better about himself and what he's doing.
About requiem. Aint it the truth...
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  #90  
Old 2007-04-11, 22:04
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Well an reply to his statement.....
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  #91  
Old 2007-04-11, 22:07
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pr0az
Well an reply to his statement.....

Like i said like 3 posts ago.

Quote:
We are both right but you are arguing something that has NO relievance to the case. It wasn't the fact that THEY are public domain as much as MUSIC can be public domain.

You're looking at it from the literal point of view, and thats not how it was intended.


You still missed what the ORIGINAL post that i mentioned bach and all them was about. It wasn't the fact that they are ancient as hell it was pointing to the fact that music can and IS public domain (able to reproduced) in certain ways. It had nothing to do with the fact that it was INDEED before 1923 because tabs haven't existed that long.

So i repose the question. What does pre-copyright laws have to do with the current situation?

And apparently i'm an asshole because i'm persistant in a disscussion. I'm not exactly sure if thats an appropriate discription to describe my retorts to your ramblings.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darko
...Its very annoying to keep having to hear some socially-disabled teen come on these boards talking about all the drugs he's started doing so that he can maybe grasp onto some kind of positive response so he feels better about himself and what he's doing.
About requiem. Aint it the truth...

Last edited by tmfreak : 2007-04-11 at 22:10.
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  #92  
Old 2007-04-11, 22:09
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmfreak
Like i said like 3 posts ago.



You still missed what the ORIGINAL post that i mentioned bach and all them was about. It wasn't the fact that they are ancient as hell it was pointing to the fact that music can and IS public domain (able to reproduced) in certain ways. It had nothing to do with the fact that it was INDEED before 1923 because tabs haven't existed that long.


.....its not the fact they are ancient as hell either...i was merely stating some facts...then you called me retarded and offended me!

However i will take this as a draw and not defeat and call us even!
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  #93  
Old 2007-04-11, 22:11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pr0az
.....its not the fact they are ancient as hell either...i was merely stating some facts...then you called me retarded and offended me!

However i will take this as a draw and not defeat and call us even!

!!
So you pointed out a personal attack. I soweys.
haha. Forgot i slipped that one in there.
It was a pst moment.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darko
...Its very annoying to keep having to hear some socially-disabled teen come on these boards talking about all the drugs he's started doing so that he can maybe grasp onto some kind of positive response so he feels better about himself and what he's doing.
About requiem. Aint it the truth...
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  #94  
Old 2007-04-11, 22:13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmfreak
!!
So you pointed out a personal attack. I soweys.
haha. Forgot i slipped that one in there.
It was a pst moment.


Thats right bitch apologize!
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  #95  
Old 2007-04-11, 22:22
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Good luck Nomad. Thanks for letting the rest of us know about this. I would like to see MT remain unchanged, but I will understand no matter what the final outcome. If I were a Lawyer I could maybe help more but in this case I can only offer my loyal support.

Again, thanks for telling us about this and thanks you for hosting my favorite web site of all time all these years.
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  #96  
Old 2007-04-12, 00:28
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Well what about guys, like Zac from Cephalic Carnage, tabbing their own songs and posting them here?
It's pretty evident most of these bands want their shit to be learned by others because it's flattering. Most of the small record companies owning the rights to the cds probably wouldn't care either. I highly doubt Matt Jacobson from Relapse could give a shit that Nile, Dying Fetus, Pig Destroyer, etc. tabs exist.

Does the NMPA think they own evey sound ever recorded or something?
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  #97  
Old 2007-04-12, 01:43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmfreak
Ain't that a bitch? You worked hard producing something and you don't even own the rights to that product.


well how you will explain this then...

in the irish folk music, there are 10000s of bands who are copying numbers from older bands... they steal the tune and make their own creation of the song...

if you talk about copyright, how is the copyright in those cases then...

Second...
Here we just talk about tabs, (in text written), produced by tab makers, which is kinda ownership of tabmakers... so in fact we own this product (the Tab), first it's not the original tab, so if original tabs were posted on Metaltabs I can understand the copyright protection... but these are all self-made tabs...
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  #98  
Old 2007-04-12, 02:50
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If people who were descendants of Beethoven, Bach, and Vivaldi could step forward, their music would not be in public domain. Don't start stupid arguments if your whole point is easily negated. In fact, if you're going to argue over something I said, just wait for me to come by and insult everybody and don't even worry about it.

Very few Irish bands have had a copyright on their songs, and with no copyright there's no copyright infringement. But a similar idea applies: how can they enforce a 'right' when there doesn't have to be any copying to have the exact same notes (i.e. if somebody can just listen to a tune and play it)? They can't. They can only enforce it if somebody copies the song or if it gets covered in a context in which the cover itself is making the band money, both of which have been the traditional domain of this argument, for that very reason. So this is a big, gay diversion, presumably for something of which we're oblivious, but which will be fucking awful.
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  #99  
Old 2007-04-12, 03:39
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The crux is that whichever way you look at the law, something has to be copyrighted in order for copyright law to be enforced. In this case, many of the bands on this site don't have tab books and so the tabs posted here are not a copy, they are "original works", for want of a better expression.

I find it highly doubtful that the potential existence of a copyright would be enforceable. Transferring accounting law to this area - and of course, in all likelihood this will not be applicable; merely useful as an example - it would have to be shown that the future copyright was "probable", not possible or remote. For instance, a publishing company would have to prove that a tablature book is currently a work in progress, or that an intention to initiate the transcription process is in place. I would find it doubtful that a legal right exists over the transcriptions if both of these conditions are not met.

Of course, the above paragraph only pertains to the possibility of arguing for the legal enforcement of a future copyright. I would still be astonished if a potential copyright is enforceable even if the above conditions were satisfied. The point still remains that the copyright doesn't physically exist and so is not enforceable.
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  #100  
Old 2007-04-12, 04:42
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Good luck Nomad, with all of this...


tmfreak, it almost sounds you work for that NMPA company??
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