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  #21  
Old 2006-09-11, 19:48
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I have a good question;

How many of you think that Dimebag Darrell's death date will be remembered and celebrated longer than 9/11?

There is no God to me if that happens.
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Originally Posted by Amadeus
It's really sad, all those people who don't understand why we shouldn't act like our enemies. The real victory is not only killing and imprisoning the terrorists, but also letting civilized manners override the lust for revenge, once the battle is over.
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  #22  
Old 2006-09-11, 20:29
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that is the stupidest question i have ever heard. 9/11 is still milked like a bitch. darrell is wont be remembered too much longer (at least, not by most the metal community. too much shit has happened in the past month).
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  #23  
Old 2006-09-11, 20:41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JOAMdude
i don't undertand the complete hat for thsi war. there are complete relgious psychos in the middle east. We stay there make it safe. give the governments a good anti crime force and then just use the delta force to kill the ones who are hiding. Some one explain the unacceptance without compoletely being a douchebag

Recently, it was shown that Al Qaidea and Iraq were not connected in the attacks, which was the catalyst for the war. Its sorta like if i am sitting in a room with you and your best friend. If you throw salt in my eyes and then punch me in the stomach and then run away really fast and hide, i start beating up your friend. Anyway, the cheif objection to this war is that the main points bush gave at the beginning for fighting it were gradually either disproven or shown to be over exaggerated. Plus, I refuse to believe that the middle east is the only place where there are crazy religious people who are willing to kill for a god they believe in. If that is the main reason to go to war, then America is gonna need a lot more boats and planes.
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Originally Posted by Darko
Compare these people to the norm, say, Muhammed SuiÁmez for instance who seems to think that lots of poorly strung together riffs spaced awkwardly around fancy monotonous sweeps covers up the fact that his ideas and songs are really quit boring.
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  #24  
Old 2006-09-11, 20:48
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"HOLY SHIT!I HAVEN'T LAUGHED SO HARD SINCE 9/11"
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  #25  
Old 2006-09-11, 20:51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blood Red Bass
Recently, it was shown that Al Qaidea and Iraq were not connected in the attacks, which was the catalyst for the war. Its sorta like if i am sitting in a room with you and your best friend. If you throw salt in my eyes and then punch me in the stomach and then run away really fast and hide, i start beating up your friend. Anyway, the cheif objection to this war is that the main points bush gave at the beginning for fighting it were gradually either disproven or shown to be over exaggerated. Plus, I refuse to believe that the middle east is the only place where there are crazy religious people who are willing to kill for a god they believe in. If that is the main reason to go to war, then America is gonna need a lot more boats and planes.


Yup, theres ur answer. Im just wondering what the logic (agenda) behind the decision to go to Iraq was. Everyone jumps to oil but that dosent make enough sense. I think Saddam beat Bush at a game of DDR and now hes pissed.
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  #26  
Old 2006-09-11, 21:02
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OK i swore up and down i wouldn't enter this but i'm just going to give.. a few cents of mine in without being too much into it because i try not to care. (here or whats goin on)

I'm not attempting to persuade you because i could care less. (why i'm speaking up i dunno) But let me tell you from somebody who somehwat knows what is going on.

This in my opinion isn't ANYTHING like the vietnam war. And i can go into that one because we could have won the war if it weren't for other issues. But anyways if you think this is a TOTAL FAILURE i think your pretty damn wrong. The amount of terrorist training camps in afghanistan and iraq that have been uncovered and destroyed is absolutely insane. Seriously. The only reason why there wasn't this "insurgency" in Iraq before was because the guy was a BRUTAL.. let me repeat BROOOTAL dictator. Who was obviously fucking paranoid as shit. He killed people just because he THOUGHT they might be somewhat against him. (being a dictator must be lonely huh.. ha) But anyways.

Without going further into the deal with iraq now because i know a lil more than the average fuck about the topic (less than those who have been over, somewhat but i hear shit ALL the time).

Anyways about the premise for going to war. Do i think its bullshit? Hell yes. I'm not going to touch whether they lied because thats completely out of my paygrade, but should we have linked wmds no probably not, should we have linked al qaeda to saddam directly. Probably not. Now sure its up to ones own morals whether they feel that democracy is their choice in government. But you can sit there and argue on some random metal forum because of the ability to do so. Those in iraq, north korea and other places don't have that right or priviledge. Should we have invaded the country and replace their dictator with somebody of our choosing? I dunno its beyond my paygrade once again and i really don't give a fuck.

But what i do care about is at least something was done to IMPROVE iraqs lives, and if you think otherwise seriously you need to wake the freak up (i'm not saying this to directly anybody but in general)

If you think the only thing this war is producing is negative effects your just seriously wrong. I've heard stories after stories of how the IRAQI people are... and not the IRANIAN and SYRANESE insurgencies are. Did anybody here know that Iran has state sponsored and supported terrorists? I.E. they have like elite para military branches that soul goal is to produces agents who go to other countries create and brew insurgents and attack governments and what not?

Should it have been our responsibility to go to Iraq NOW and take care of their freedom rights issues? Eh not gonna touch that but probably not. But you know what i think there is growing sentiment that hte UN is fucking worthless. Seriously. Still NO issue with North Korea or Iran. What the FUCK. So yeah i guess it is our responsiblity since nobody else is willing except the Israelis who are just militant as fuck, but who can blame them countries like Iran over the news say shit htey should be whiped off the map and nobody is doing fuck about it. How can you be apart of a global economy and global world saying shit like that.. Can we say.. MHMMMMMM Hitler circa 1930s. I mean do we just let bullshit comments like that slide nowadays? Sure we shouldn't lose our cool and go bomb the fuck out of them. But sanction them to death. Do something instead of just setting bullshit time lines and dates where nothing is probably even going to happen.


Ok enough ranting. Oh yeah earlier blood red bass you mentioned wars. What about WWI?
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Last edited by tmfreak : 2006-09-11 at 21:11.
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  #27  
Old 2006-09-11, 21:06
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmfreak

Ok enough ranting. Oh yeah earlier blood red bass you mentioned wars. What about WWI?

Sorry, WWII kinda gets most of the attention. But yeah, same point, WWI everyone still were behind a solid reason as to why they were fighting. The german submarines were fucking around too much and europe was once again in lots of trouble.
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Originally Posted by Darko
Compare these people to the norm, say, Muhammed SuiÁmez for instance who seems to think that lots of poorly strung together riffs spaced awkwardly around fancy monotonous sweeps covers up the fact that his ideas and songs are really quit boring.
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  #28  
Old 2006-09-11, 21:09
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blood Red Bass
Sorry, WWII kinda gets most of the attention. But yeah, same point, WWI everyone still were behind a solid reason as to why they were fighting. The german submarines were fucking around too much and europe was once again in lots of trouble.



yeah me and my friend were talking about that as we were walking around DC the other month. The WW1 monument was fucking .... sad. Its tiny and doesn't have anything, then they recently opened up this new WW2 monument thats huge and amazing. Its like ok i guess WW1 wasn't worth anything. Even though rediculous.. beyond rediculous amount of people died in that war. Just a slaughter to be honest.
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Originally Posted by Darko
...Its very annoying to keep having to hear some socially-disabled teen come on these boards talking about all the drugs he's started doing so that he can maybe grasp onto some kind of positive response so he feels better about himself and what he's doing.
About requiem. Aint it the truth...
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  #29  
Old 2006-09-11, 21:37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmfreak
yeah me and my friend were talking about that as we were walking around DC the other month. The WW1 monument was fucking .... sad. Its tiny and doesn't have anything, then they recently opened up this new WW2 monument thats huge and amazing. Its like ok i guess WW1 wasn't worth anything. Even though rediculous.. beyond rediculous amount of people died in that war. Just a slaughter to be honest.

Yeah, isnt the statistic like only 1/3 of the people who died in the war died from actual enemy fire....or mustard gas? The rest of it was the flu and other stuff. Anyway, earlier i did not mean to offend you or anything. My main point was that most all other major wars in america had the majority of public support WHILE they were being fought.Pre-WWI America was trying to be committed to isolationism but it just didnt work out.
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Originally Posted by Darko
Compare these people to the norm, say, Muhammed SuiÁmez for instance who seems to think that lots of poorly strung together riffs spaced awkwardly around fancy monotonous sweeps covers up the fact that his ideas and songs are really quit boring.
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  #30  
Old 2006-09-11, 22:07
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blood Red Bass
Yeah, isnt the statistic like only 1/3 of the people who died in the war died from actual enemy fire....or mustard gas? The rest of it was the flu and other stuff. Anyway, earlier i did not mean to offend you or anything. My main point was that most all other major wars in america had the majority of public support WHILE they were being fought.Pre-WWI America was trying to be committed to isolationism but it just didnt work out.



Nah its cool. I mean i more meant less to attack any one person especially of this forum, but more of a hey if you dont' know this, lets open our eyes kinda thing.

But i know what you mean (about the isolationism) kinda thing. But in my opinion overall basis for comparing of wars fought.. for the most part any time in the past is kind of trivial now. Simply because in my opinion the global world that we have together is so interveniously connected together that i mean where one thing happens it effects every body else. So these even conservative views of you know.. forget the UN... or hey lets just take care of our own and let others take care of their problems.. Eh its just not that simple. Especially not today. And i think in most cases its GOOD that we are so globally connected, but in obvious cases its very much not so.
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Originally Posted by Darko
...Its very annoying to keep having to hear some socially-disabled teen come on these boards talking about all the drugs he's started doing so that he can maybe grasp onto some kind of positive response so he feels better about himself and what he's doing.
About requiem. Aint it the truth...
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  #31  
Old 2006-09-11, 22:16
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Face it, the USA is testing its powers and boundaries, slowly decreasing freedoms and increasing their power. All this security shit? It makes the average person feel afraid, so they cling to their government for protection. Today in class, the teacher asked who doesn't feel safe anymore, I was like only one that DIDN'T raise my hand, and I didn't just do that to be lazy. We're in no more danger now than we were before. Another thing is, 3006 people isn't really that much. Go read the book "1984". I think things are becoming so similar to the government in that book that it's scary. The government is going to milk this 9/11 shit (and the premise of 9/11 was a lie set up by the government) for all it can. Who didn't feel more patriotic and supportive of the government today? Within our life times we'll see a drastic decrease in personal freedoms. Already we have bullshit like the "Patriot Act", letting the government tap into our conversations. It's totally unnecesary. And calling it the "Patriot" Act adds a little twist of propaganda to it, making you think not supporting it would mean not being patriotic.

Now to prepare myself for the flames

Last edited by 4d5e6f : 2006-09-11 at 22:19.
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  #32  
Old 2006-09-11, 22:23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4d5e6f
Face it, the USA is testing its powers and boundaries, slowly decreasing freedoms and increasing their power. All this security shit? It makes the average person feel afraid, so they cling to their government for protection. Today in class, the teacher asked who doesn't feel safe anymore, I was like only one that DIDN'T raise my hand, and I didn't just do that to be lazy. We're in no more danger now than we were before. Another thing is, 3006 people isn't really that much. Go read the book "1984". I think things are becoming so similar to the government in that book that it's scary. The government is going to milk this 9/11 shit (and the premise of 9/11 was a lie set up by the government) for all it can. Who didn't feel more patriotic and supportive of the government today? Within our life times we'll see a drastic decrease in personal freedoms. Already we have bullshit like the "Patriot Act", letting the government tap into our conversations. It's totally unnecesary. And calling it the "Patriot" Act adds a little twist of propaganda to it, making you think not supporting it would mean not being patriotic.

Now to prepare myself for the flames

3006 people is not that much........huh, that is wrong in so many ways I'll let one of the guys here who are in the military handle that one. Anyway unless you have a document or other credible source to back up such a claim as the one I bolded in your statement, careful what you say.
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Originally Posted by Darko
Compare these people to the norm, say, Muhammed SuiÁmez for instance who seems to think that lots of poorly strung together riffs spaced awkwardly around fancy monotonous sweeps covers up the fact that his ideas and songs are really quit boring.
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  #33  
Old 2006-09-11, 22:31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blood Red Bass
3006 people is not that much........huh, that is wrong in so many ways I'll let one of the guys here who are in the military handle that one. Anyway unless you have a document or other credible source to back up such a claim as the one I bolded in your statement, careful what you say.


www.911review.com is one. There's a shitload of sources on the internet. Just read them with an open mind.

All the facts are in your face, and you are too naive to interpret them for what they are. And alse, out of millions of people, 3006 really isn't that big of a number to me. I know I'd be crushed if I lost a relative in the demise of the towers, but personal anguish doesn't change statistics and facts.

Last edited by 4d5e6f : 2006-09-11 at 22:33.
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  #34  
Old 2006-09-11, 22:33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4d5e6f
www.911review.com

All the facts are in your face, and you are too naive to interpret them for what they are. And alse, out of millions of people, 3006 really isn't that big of a number to me. I know I'd be crushed if I lost a relative in the demise of the towers, but personal anguish doesn't change statistics and facts.

The toes on your left feet do not make up a large percentage of your body, so I'm sure you wouldnt mind if someone took it.
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Originally Posted by Darko
Compare these people to the norm, say, Muhammed SuiÁmez for instance who seems to think that lots of poorly strung together riffs spaced awkwardly around fancy monotonous sweeps covers up the fact that his ideas and songs are really quit boring.
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  #35  
Old 2006-09-11, 22:35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blood Red Bass
The toes on your left feet do not make up a large percentage of your body, so I'm sure you wouldnt mind if someone took it.


Bad analogy. The nation isn't a living thing with fingers and toes.
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  #36  
Old 2006-09-11, 22:40
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Although what 4d5e6f said isnt the most radical thing I have heard, it is one of the reasons that people on the left when it comes to this argument have less credibility. When you get people that call themselves "radicals" yelling things like "The American government orchestrated 9/11, they are listening to your phone conversations right now!!!! Everyone put aluminium foil on your heads!!!" it really ends up being a step backwards because then, whenever a level headed leftist tries to make an argument, they get lumped in with the whackjob conspiracy theorists.

But I do agree however that the government has definitely been misleading the public with horrible fear tactics. Whatever happened to the terror alert meter? Exactly. But this isnt a republican thing, its a political thing. If you scare a nation of people and then offer to protect them from the monsters hiding under their beds, they will elect you.

Quote:
All the facts are in your face, and you are too naive to interpret them for what they are.


Im glad you mentioned that, because that brings up another point. Just as the current administration has fed the public a lot of exaggerations to get them behind their policies, the other side will do the same. You do not know that the things on that website are fact, but people will believe that they are if they are presented as such.
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Originally Posted by the_bleeding
buy a stick of graphite (art stores) and rub it into your nut

Last edited by Valtiel : 2006-09-11 at 22:43.
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  #37  
Old 2006-09-11, 22:41
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Heres my view
We were attacked. No body fucks with us. We kill terrorists, and "bad" people. theres nothing to bitch about. Im 100% sure we would have been attacked again if it were not for our brave actions and soldiers. All of you pussy scum can sit there and ask for reduction of funds to the war etc. while you sit masturbating on your couch while youre safe at home. I dont see your ass out there fighting for whats right. so shut the fuck up.
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  #38  
Old 2006-09-11, 22:44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shreddist
Heres my view
We were attacked. No body fucks with us. We kill terrorists, and "bad" people. theres nothing to bitch about. Im 100% sure we would have been attacked again if it were not for our brave actions and soldiers. All of you pussy scum can sit there and ask for reduction of funds to the war etc. while you sit masturbating on your couch while youre safe at home. I dont see your ass out there fighting for whats right. so shut the fuck up.




You should probably stay out of these arguments if thats how you present yours.

Its all about nuance. There is no "good vs evil". Its that kind of "either you're with us or against us" kind of attitude that got us into this mess.

Plus, according to your profile you are 17. Not sayin 17 year olds cant have an opinion, but you might want to filter yours with some rational thought first.
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Quote:
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buy a stick of graphite (art stores) and rub it into your nut

Last edited by Valtiel : 2006-09-11 at 22:47.
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  #39  
Old 2006-09-11, 22:47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4d5e6f
Bad analogy. The nation isn't a living thing with fingers and toes.

The toes equate to the people killed. Both are small percentages of a greater thing. (human body> toes) (number of people> total population). If anyone else thought that analogy was confusing please tell me, I thought it was simple to understand.
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Originally Posted by Darko
Compare these people to the norm, say, Muhammed SuiÁmez for instance who seems to think that lots of poorly strung together riffs spaced awkwardly around fancy monotonous sweeps covers up the fact that his ideas and songs are really quit boring.
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  #40  
Old 2006-09-11, 22:47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shreddist
Heres my view
We were attacked. No body fucks with us. We kill terrorists, and "bad" people. theres nothing to bitch about. Im 100% sure we would have been attacked again if it were not for our brave actions and soldiers. All of you pussy scum can sit there and ask for reduction of funds to the war etc. while you sit masturbating on your couch while youre safe at home. I dont see your ass out there fighting for whats right. so shut the fuck up.

Quite a simple view of a very complex thing......hrm.
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Compare these people to the norm, say, Muhammed SuiÁmez for instance who seems to think that lots of poorly strung together riffs spaced awkwardly around fancy monotonous sweeps covers up the fact that his ideas and songs are really quit boring.
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