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  #101  
Old 2005-12-11, 18:24
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Don't limit yourself to just economy picking style. Verse yourself with strict alternate. It's very powerful for speed. I would bet if you practice econ. picking those patterns enough, you'll build speed...maybe not paul gilbert speed
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  #102  
Old 2005-12-11, 18:36
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Economy picking is a very good way to develope speed runs with 3 notes per string. But it is a very good idea to practice strick alternate picking as well.

I actually have developed a technique where I incorporate economy picking when doing three not per string runs, and alternate picking when doing 4 notes per string.

I don't know how far along you are, but (as unorthodoxed as it may sound) try to find 4 note per string patterns, and incorporate a strict alternate picking regimen with these (chromatics are a good start). I subconsciously know when to economy pick vs alternate pick, depending on the amount of notes I'm playing, and depending on whether it's an upstroke or downstroke to the next string. It is a very good idea to perfect both of these to add to you repertoire, and then to be able to tell the difference between which one to use when doing elaborate runs.

The next step will be to find which one works for string skipping (like open voiced appregios) because you are going to lose the advantage of economy picking when it comes to this (but in some circumstances, I still use it).

So good luck, and if you have any questions, feel free to ask.
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  #103  
Old 2005-12-12, 16:32
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Does anyone know the name of the recessed washers used to house the screws that bolt a bolt-on neck to the body? I'm trying to order some and need to know the 'name' of them. Thanks
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  #104  
Old 2005-12-12, 20:12
KevC KevC is offline
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man, i've been playing economy style for almost 3 years now, when i try to alternate is hard as hell, i can't keep track, since i'm so used to economy picking that its second nature pretty much..think i should try to change it?
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  #105  
Old 2005-12-13, 01:40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KevC
man, i've been playing economy style for almost 3 years now, when i try to alternate is hard as hell, i can't keep track, since i'm so used to economy picking that its second nature pretty much..think i should try to change it?

I have the same problem...do you notice that when you play faster licks your playing gets a bit sloppy? This is the problem I have, my frethand refuses to keep up with my pickhand. I've been trying to practice strict alternate picking but it's hard as hell, especially when you're as impatient as me. Anyway, I would say, do learn it. I mean, it can't really hurt anything...I don't think anyway. But it should help with synchronizing your hands for faster playing.
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  #106  
Old 2005-12-13, 10:00
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KevC
man, i've been playing economy style for almost 3 years now, when i try to alternate is hard as hell, i can't keep track, since i'm so used to economy picking that its second nature pretty much..think i should try to change it?



No! Not yet, at least...

I didn't do anything but strict alternate picking for about 10 years, then went to sweeping, then economy. I noticed after a while, my speed increased A LOT with economy, but I had lost the effectiveness I used to have with alternate picking. Basically, my alternate picking wasn't as good as it used to be...

But after developing some exercises that helped me, my alternate picking became more fluent when going from string to string, still incorporating economy picking in certain spots.

That's why I suggest still sticking with economy on three note per string runs, but look at 4 note per string patterns, like wide interval triadic stuff and chromatics to practice strict alternate picking.
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  #107  
Old 2005-12-13, 19:34
KevC KevC is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ulrichmc
I have the same problem...do you notice that when you play faster licks your playing gets a bit sloppy? This is the problem I have, my frethand refuses to keep up with my pickhand. I've been trying to practice strict alternate picking but it's hard as hell, especially when you're as impatient as me. Anyway, I would say, do learn it. I mean, it can't really hurt anything...I don't think anyway. But it should help with synchronizing your hands for faster playing.


yeah, i get real sloppy on patterns that go against a natural economy picking motion if you get what i'm trying to say. It's almost impossible for me to keep track of i'm on a down stroke or a up stroke...any ideas on how to counter that?

jaxadam: what exercises did you do you get your alternate picking back up to speed?
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  #108  
Old 2005-12-13, 19:51
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I don't know how to tab on here, but I've used chromatics and different variations of them for alternate picking, because you will retain fluidity with the 4 note chromatic scales when moving from one string to the other.

I also use wide interval triadics, but I'll play four notes, say something like:


... starting on low E

G: 13 20 16 19
D: 16 13 19 16
A: 12 19 16 12
E: 16 12 19 16

Which is an E Major wide interval triadic, or B mixolydian (however you want to look at it, but I play 7 string a lot).

This is good for two things: obviously playing 4 notes per string to aquire fluid alternate picking between strings, and also stretching your fingers for wide interval stuff.

I've been making my own practice exercises up for years (actually everytime I sit down to play, I make something up that will incorporate some technique and theory), and I've got some really good stuff for economy, sweeping, and alternate picking as well, that has REALLY worked not just for me, but for other people as well.

Might not work for everybody, some people may even already do this stuff, but it is a simple exercise that is helpful in a few ways. Maybe I need to find a way to post more ideas!
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  #109  
Old 2005-12-13, 19:55
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P.S. It's actually funny; I thought it was easier to learn alternate picking before economy picking, and it was a very long time before I started stressing economy picking, but it seems like the exact opposite for members on this board! (which might be a good thing!).

I literally did not start economy picking until after a class I had with Joe Stump at Berklee (in 1996). He blazed up and down the neck, and I went up to him after class and asked him if he was strictly economy picking, and he said "Yes", so I went back to my room and started then and there.

But if you guys are starting out with economy picking and not having a hard time with it, I suggest you keep doing what you're doing, because that is very good, to be able to fluenty economy pick up and down the neck.
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  #110  
Old 2005-12-16, 17:39
KevC KevC is offline
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hey i got another question, when you shred are you using tremelo picking or alternate picking?
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  #111  
Old 2005-12-16, 18:16
DanOfTheDead DanOfTheDead is offline
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tremolo picking IS alternate picking...
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  #112  
Old 2005-12-17, 07:23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaxadam
But if you guys are starting out with economy picking and not having a hard time with it, I suggest you keep doing what you're doing, because that is very good, to be able to fluenty economy pick up and down the neck.


I think it just depends on what you start with. I have always (8 years) used strict alternate picking, no matter how many notes per string I'm playing, it was drummed into me by my guitar teacher, and I find it incredibly unnatural to do economy picking - it just feels wrong.
Whichever one you start with, the other one will feel strange.
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  #113  
Old 2005-12-17, 09:24
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Yeah, I was the same way. I did strick alternate picking for pretty much my whole playing career until just a few years ago. I messed with economy picking a while back, but kept with alternate, because that was what I was most comfortable with. They I just decided to switch it up and hammer it in, and so I started doing some exercises to incorporate economy picking, and it felt very wierd for a while, but then my speed really increased, and my strict alternate picking went downhill. So I did some drills to bring it back up to speed, and now I practice them both equally, and find advatages and disadvantages of using one vs another in certain situations. If my next stroke is going to be a downstroke to the next string, I'll be using strict alternate; if my next stroke is going naturally want to be an upstroke, I'll change it to a downstroke essentially using economy picking.
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  #114  
Old 2005-12-17, 18:53
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IlikeRiffseveryone IlikeRiffseveryone is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaxadam
I don't know how to tab on here, but I've used chromatics and different variations of them for alternate picking, because you will retain fluidity with the 4 note chromatic scales when moving from one string to the other.

I also use wide interval triadics, but I'll play four notes, say something like:


... starting on low E

G: 13 20 16 19
D: 16 13 19 16
A: 12 19 16 12
E: 16 12 19 16

Which is an E Major wide interval triadic, or B mixolydian (however you want to look at it, but I play 7 string a lot).

This is good for two things: obviously playing 4 notes per string to aquire fluid alternate picking between strings, and also stretching your fingers for wide interval stuff.

I've been making my own practice exercises up for years (actually everytime I sit down to play, I make something up that will incorporate some technique and theory), and I've got some really good stuff for economy, sweeping, and alternate picking as well, that has REALLY worked not just for me, but for other people as well.

Might not work for everybody, some people may even already do this stuff, but it is a simple exercise that is helpful in a few ways. Maybe I need to find a way to post more ideas!


Word, anything can be an excersise if you go about it the right way

And i've always done economy, it just seems like starting a new alternate picking sequence on a new string, frankly there doesnt seem to be much of a difference between the two besides one stroke
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  #115  
Old 2005-12-18, 04:15
Exodus666 Exodus666 is offline
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Another question about tuning & string sizes:

I have a guitar with fixed bridge in standard E tuning with 10-46 strings. If I want to tune it to C, I can just replace my strings with thicker ones, right? Which would be most fitting?
I was thinking about 11-52 but maybe they'll be a tad too loose?
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  #116  
Old 2005-12-18, 06:02
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exodus666
Another question about tuning & string sizes:

I have a guitar with fixed bridge in standard E tuning with 10-46 strings. If I want to tune it to C, I can just replace my strings with thicker ones, right? Which would be most fitting?
I was thinking about 11-52 but maybe they'll be a tad too loose?



11 - 52 will be good for C tuning. I personally use .12's
And yess you can just re-string your guitar with the bigger gauge. maybe you need to adjust your neck relief afterwards.
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  #117  
Old 2005-12-18, 07:46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exodus666
I have a guitar with fixed bridge in standard E tuning with 10-46 strings. If I want to tune it to C, I can just replace my strings with thicker ones, right? Which would be most fitting?
I was thinking about 11-52 but maybe they'll be a tad too loose?


If you're playing with 10s in E, then you'll probably be most comfortable with 12s in C.
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  #118  
Old 2005-12-18, 09:34
Exodus666 Exodus666 is offline
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So 12-56, or 12-52? Thx for the replies btw.
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  #119  
Old 2005-12-19, 15:02
ThornsOfHeaven200 ThornsOfHeaven200 is offline
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Yet another question about tuning & string guages:
I normally play with 10-52 guage strings in standard tuning on my 25.5 in. scale guitar and I've recently been playing alot of Nile. I found out that Karl plays with string guages: 10-12-17-38-50-70 in drop-A. Would that be about the same tension(besides the three thin strings) as playing with my setup? If not what would be the best guages for drop-A tuning? Does anybody know where to get guages like Karl's, I can't seem to find them in any stores?
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  #120  
Old 2005-12-20, 00:56
metalmick metalmick is offline
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tuning

Can anyone tell me what gauge strings i should get to tune to b on a 25 1/2 guitar? Also is tuning low to b be a problem since its not a baritone?
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