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  #1  
Old 2004-12-30, 10:43
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nile?

i guess this could have gone in a couple of places, but it is more theory related
(john since your a huge nile guy i guess this is more towards you, but anyone can reply)

what do nile harmonize in to get that egyptian sound? i was watching some of their shit(live and music video) and when they do leads they almost always harmonize them
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  #2  
Old 2004-12-30, 11:57
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Hmm, I don't think they have a standard harmonization that they use exclusively but mainly they harmonize, in octaves and fifths. For example, in some of my tabs I have the following written:

Code:
B |------| F#|------| D |--10--| A |---8--| E |---8--| A |---8--|


When it should in fact be:

Code:
|Gtr1 B |------| F#|------| D |--10--| A |------| E |------| A |------| | |Gtr2 B |------| F#|------| D |------| A |---8--| E |------| A |---8--|


It's easier for one guitar to attain the sound of the latter by playing the former. They do this sort of harmonization quite a lot but as I said earlier, the other stuff is mainly harmonized in octaves, fifths and possibly minor 3rds.
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  #3  
Old 2004-12-30, 14:05
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Yeah, perfect fifths and sometimes octaves are usually what you think of what "egyption" sounds like. Minor 3rds and also major 3rds are what you usually always use in BM.
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  #4  
Old 2004-12-30, 14:09
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Yep, the minor and major thirds form the diad shapes that black metal bands are so fond of. I think it sounds quite cool when these intervals are used to harmonize though - Cryptopsy use this arrangement quite a bit on And Then You'll Beg.
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  #5  
Old 2004-12-30, 14:25
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dont iron maiden use 3rds ALOT too?
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  #6  
Old 2004-12-30, 14:37
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Not sure - I've only heard a few of their songs on the TV. From what I can hear, they probably harmonize in fifths more than anything.
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  #7  
Old 2004-12-30, 14:40
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hmm maybe it is 5ths, i still havnt really trained my ears to tell yet
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  #8  
Old 2004-12-30, 14:47
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Well, I've just checked a couple of the tabs here and they used major 3rds in them. Usually, I have a little trick: try to imagine that it isn't two separate guitars playing one note each but instead a diad played on one guitar. Then try to mimic the diad formed by the two notes on the guitar (or piano, etc). This should help towards training you ear. I'm OK with identifying minor third, fifth and octave harmonizations but I need to work on the others a bit more.
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  #9  
Old 2004-12-30, 14:55
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That, and maybe can't distinguish if it's a m3 and p5; or a M6 and p4.
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  #10  
Old 2005-01-03, 11:20
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I haven´t ghot very good earing but, if you play the Eolian (or minor) scale harmonized in thirds it sound heavy metalish (it sounds iron maiden exactly, I think)
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  #11  
Old 2005-01-03, 15:28
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I think Nile use P4's as well...well I'm pretty sure that's what their doing in that riff in Sarcophagus after the little mini-lead type thing, not the outro one.
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  #12  
Old 2005-01-13, 21:04
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guitar_demon
dont iron maiden use 3rds ALOT too?


i know they harmonize a lot where the root note is in the octave above the third. so its like a third and an eigth

also a couple of other scale questions

can anyone post any scales thet arent common ones i like the types of stuff that slayer uses which are very chromatic scales but i dont know any of them. also does dave mustaine use a weird scale when he solos becasue a lot of his solos sound not in a regular major or minor scale. or maybe hes jut really amazing and knows how to use the scales.

thanks in advance.
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  #13  
Old 2005-01-17, 11:49
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I don't think Slayer has ever written in any specific scale apart from Show No Mercy. The only real scale pattern you could put for them is as follows:


|---------------------------------|
|---------------------------------|
|---------------------------------|
|-----------------------0-1-2-3-4-|
|------------0-1-2-3-4------------|
|-0-1-2-3-4-----------------------| etc.
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  #14  
Old 2005-01-17, 19:22
Thrashboy Thrashboy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by briyo2289
i know they harmonize a lot where the root note is in the octave above the third. so its like a third and an eigth

also a couple of other scale questions

can anyone post any scales thet arent common ones i like the types of stuff that slayer uses which are very chromatic scales but i dont know any of them. also does dave mustaine use a weird scale when he solos becasue a lot of his solos sound not in a regular major or minor scale. or maybe hes jut really amazing and knows how to use the scales.

thanks in advance.



from watching thier hands, slayer does allot of.... I don't know how to form tab on here so....

568
56X8

basically pointer finger, middle finger, pinky pattern.
note, half step, whole step

get it?

Then they just run around randomly using that pattern of note, half, whole step. So it turns out to be chraomatic but they are usually not going 1234 its 124. like 124 235 346 457 568 ect.

Only sounds cool because its so fast. If you play a slayer solo at a slow speed it sounds like garbage. At the speed they play, its too fast to really make it out, so really, it doesn't matter so much what notes they hit.

And Mustaine, and far as I know he plays allot of major minor scales. Some exotic scales some times, but mostly the regular scales. He just has a superb grasp on theory and melds with the rythm guitar perfectly to make some cool ass shit. the sounds you can get from major/minor are basicly unlimited if you know how to combine it with the rythm guitars part in cool and interesting ways.
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  #15  
Old 2005-01-17, 19:44
TheDreadfulHoroscope TheDreadfulHoroscope is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guitar_demon
dont iron maiden use 3rds ALOT too?


Actually, that makes alot of sence, since alot of thier songs are in minor keys.
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  #16  
Old 2005-03-14, 20:12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thrashboy
from watching thier hands, slayer does allot of.... I don't know how to form tab on here so....

568
56X8

basically pointer finger, middle finger, pinky pattern.
note, half step, whole step

get it?

Then they just run around randomly using that pattern of note, half, whole step. So it turns out to be chraomatic but they are usually not going 1234 its 124. like 124 235 346 457 568 ect.

Only sounds cool because its so fast. If you play a slayer solo at a slow speed it sounds like garbage. At the speed they play, its too fast to really make it out, so really, it doesn't matter so much what notes they hit.



That seems quite strange to me... I've always thought those guys knew enough about music to do more than just playing patterns repeatedly...
I'm not a big fan but what I've heard from them had a lot of cool harmonization and, for sure, scalar patterns. I'll go listen to their shit right now and come back with more infos.
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  #17  
Old 2005-03-19, 20:10
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fudge, i was hoping for some wickedly technical harmonizing that only a slovenian person could pronounce properly
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  #18  
Old 2005-06-26, 01:34
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Mustaine is completely self taught-hardly knows any theoryu. He has been taking lessons very recently though.
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  #19  
Old 2005-06-26, 02:16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by \m/Eat At Joe's\m/
Mustaine is completely self taught-hardly knows any theoryu. He has been taking lessons very recently though.


You got to be shitting me! Where did you hear that. I know he was self made after 82 but I remember stories of him teaching KFK theory and alt picking while youngsters. He did just start taking lessons again recently though. I think it has helped him a ton too.
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  #20  
Old 2005-06-26, 09:17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soulinsane
You got to be shitting me! Where did you hear that. I know he was self made after 82 but I remember stories of him teaching KFK theory and alt picking while youngsters. He did just start taking lessons again recently though. I think it has helped him a ton too.

yea i remember readin an interview with mustaine where he said he tought KK how to invert chords and other stuff
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