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  #21  
Old 2004-11-01, 21:13
IRON FART IRON FART is offline
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IMO Any guy who paints their nails or wears excessive facepaint is a fag. It isn't cool, it doesn't improve their image, and it never will. I see people who do stuff like that as very vain, and they lose my respect for doing that.
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  #22  
Old 2004-11-01, 22:00
Credit to Dementia Credit to Dementia is offline
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Face paint was interesting when it was used to present contrast. Who are Kiss? Well, they're the band that dresses up in black and glittery silver and paint odd white faces on. Mercyful Fate are the band with that King guy with a painted face and top hat. Early black metal still had this; it provided a distinction for their genre that still had connections with the music, thematically. Was it silly? Hell yes. It was silly in Ziggy Stardust and has only gotten sillier. But there was a point to doing it. It wasn't just a convention, mandated from the black metal gods who allow no progress whatsoever in the genre to be tolerated, that was done just because it was done.

Now, as somebody mentioned, death metal bands tend to all look similar as well: long hair, jeans, black band t-shirts, etc. This is reasonably true, but there's a major difference: there's not too much thought put up into that ensemble. Metalheads just tend to look like that. Shockingly enough, metal bands tend to be made up of metalheads, and they dress as they would normally. Something makes me seriously doubt that black metallers would go to a bar or report to work in a warehouse or something in corpse paint, with fake blood smeared here and there, black leather bondage gear, and upside-down crucifixes. It's a very theatrical thing, which is fine in itself, but it's been foisted on an entire genre when it's not always necessary.

Sometimes, just playing well and energetically is enough.
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  #23  
Old 2004-11-01, 22:08
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Face paint has its limits. Its cool to do it on Halloween or some sort of costume. A lot of black metal bands actually look cool doing it, like Immortal or 1349. Some jackasses, mainly those goths, take it up the ass with that though.
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  #24  
Old 2004-11-01, 22:30
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I guess you'd have to consider the central ideology behind black metal, the nihilistic views, and the antichurch feelings. That was what their music was about, alot of metaphors for nihilism included satan ruling, or returning to a natural enviornment. The viking metal is similar in that the theme of returning to the viking area is again a symbol of their beliefs and ideology. Therefore it's safe and accurate to assume that the face paint is also representitive of their views. The fact that all of you think it's stupid is showing that they accomplished thier central goal, to go against society. The sum of thier ideologies leads to some over the top anti social goals and views. That's all in the nihilistic beliefs. If you think this is going too much into the music then you've nevere heard an interview with these guys, never read lyrics. It's only a few amount of people who can truly apreciate black metal, it takes a really rare personality, and the way its desined keeps others from transitioning to black metal. That's why bands like CoF aren't really black metal. They don't share the same views and are really out just to get rich. They don't even use the same style, they use a more pop song model for thier black metal immitation. I mean if you're going to insult a style, at least know what you're talking about a little tiny bit.
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  #25  
Old 2004-11-01, 22:46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bloodredthrone
The fact that all of you think it's stupid is showing that they accomplished thier central goal, to go against society.

An internet forum made up largely of thrash and death fans is not exactly the perfect representation of modern society. Generally, it's considered an accomplishment in going against society if society finds you frightening, threatening, or inexplicable, not if they just think you're being an idiot.

However, you explanation of their nihilism, while acceptable, does not explain what's nihilistic about painting your face. It's 'safe to assume' the face painting goes along with their views, sure, but unless it goes along in a reasonable way it's just theatrics.

The majority of your post just seemed to say 'I'm special because I really understand black metal when only a few people can really get it, and the rest of you are ignorant fools for mocking it.' I hear that same argument fairly often, from Star Trek fans. Interesting. Whenever somebody represents 'true' black metal to me, it's always an excessively claustrophobic, intolerant, exclusionary, sectarian, and occasionally violent genre that claims to be going against postmodernity and its trend towards conformity by enforcing its own micro-conformity even more zealously. Nihilism is not new, nor is it special, and it can't be used to justify everything. Most nihilists are infrequently more impressive than those of The Big Lebowski, and if true black metallers want to be included in with them it's cool by me.
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Last edited by Credit to Dementia : 2004-11-01 at 23:21.
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  #26  
Old 2004-11-02, 00:41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bloodredthrone
That was what their music was about, alot of metaphors for nihilism included satan ruling, or returning to a natural enviornment......The sum of thier ideologies leads to some over the top anti social goals and views. That's all in the nihilistic beliefs.



Haha, since you like to throw around the term so much, why don't you stop and consider what nihilism really means? Since the true definition of nihilism is that ALL values are baseless and that absolutely NOTHING can be known or communicated, wouldn't the music of a true nihilistic band just be absolute silence? And since nothing can be communicated, what's the point of even playing? A true nihilist would believe in nothing at all, that includes your "satan ruling" and "returning to the natural environment". And the phrase "nihilistic beliefs" would then in turn be an oxymoron, since nihilism is the absence of belief, including all "ideologies", "goals", and "views". Why don't you get off your "bloodredthrone", stop trying to lecture us like we're a bunch of your disciples (no one here is going to respect you for that), and do your research jackass.
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  #27  
Old 2004-11-02, 00:47
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Masks are dumb too. I wish The Berzerker didn't use them.
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  #28  
Old 2004-11-02, 00:47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Transient
wow....who cares? i dont know about you guys, but when i hear a bands cd i dont see the makeup

good one man. people seem to cut down too many bands due to image. I hate that. If i buy a cd in which the music agrees with me, i dont care how the members choose to look. thats either their choice or their problem. but as long as they are making music i enjoy, they can look how ever the fuck they want. I wont let that ruin it for me. I play black metal, actually my style is changing drastically into a much more melodic and slower paced music, but im not forgetting my old stuff, especially since its not offically recorded yet. but i dont and wont do that paint shit. its just not me. But like i said, i wont judge a band on looks, too many people do that and it bothers me.
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  #29  
Old 2004-11-02, 01:06
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Infinity
Masks are dumb too. I wish The Berzerker didn't use them.


took the words right outta my mouth.
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  #30  
Old 2004-11-02, 01:15
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Yeah. I can't help but think of slipknot when I see masked band members.
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  #31  
Old 2004-11-02, 01:47
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Here's how I see the whole corpse paint thing, and which I hope is the reason behind the whole thing. I think, and what I mean by "think" is if I were in their shoes, the reason black metal bands were the whole corpse paint is to piss off christians. Now if this is the reason, then more power to them. Christians use stereotypes when it comes to satanists. Dressed completely in black, long black hair, inverted crosses, pail skin. In other word, goths. What black metal guys seem to do is to raise the bar with the covered in blood thing and the corpse paint. The battle axes and shit like that I'm a bit foggy on, but I see the whole thing as a slap in the face of christians.

I admit it, I get my kicks from pissing off the high and mighty christians who judge everyone, they deserve it. But I will not dress like a pussy goth to do so, I'll let the long hair and Dying Fetus shirts do all the work. If they get offended its their problem. If they talk to me they'll see I'm one of the nicest guys they'll ever meet. Anyways, I think they do it to get a rise out of people, but I know they are some who do take it serious. I don't care what they look like, if their music owns then I don't care what they look like. Honestly, Gorgoroth is the only black metal band with awesome corpse paint. And we all know how the christian race feel about them.

My opinon, the coolest corpse paint out there (except the guy on the far right), Gorgoroth!
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  #32  
Old 2004-11-02, 05:27
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Fuck you, every single one of you. Any band should be allowed to do what ever the hell they want to do, no matter what you think. You know why? Because if they care about what you think they are no longer making the music for themselves. If I want to jump around dressed in a bath robe looking like a bird shat on my face, I will, because I want to and I do it for my own satisfaction. BM started out as a genre which wasn't tailored for everyone and the BM people didn't care about what others thought, they created music very few people understood.
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  #33  
Old 2004-11-02, 06:29
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You dont see the point. Corpse paint is being exploited as commercial bullshit. "We are black metal - we simply HAVE to wear corpsepaint". Dimmu Borgir and Cradle of Filth are responsible for this I say.

I'm into death metal and grindcore and all that shit. But I wear a uniform, I wear normal clothes, COLOURS to! Yeah, I'll wear a red or blue shirt. I dont have necklaces of pentagrams and I dont act up in school. I be nice to mormons when they knock on my door and shit.

It's because of this that normal kids won't hang around me because I'm that fraction disordinary, and 'Metal' guys wont accept me because I'm to normal, or Trendy, as I've been called by a certain Transient. It's total Bullshit. What I hate about everything is that it has an image. Well I've got an image, my own.
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  #34  
Old 2004-11-02, 06:31
Credit to Dementia Credit to Dementia is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrokenCrimson
Any band should be allowed to do what ever the hell they want to do, no matter what you think.

True. And I should be able to call them stupid. If they want the freedom to wear make up, I want the freedom to make fun of them for it. If they want the right to make a statement, I reserve the right to critique it. If you won't give me that much, fuck you and fuck your half-assed, one-sided defense of freedom of expression.

Though, as I said, when every single band in the genre, and no one else, does it, it begins to appear less as a genuine expression and more as something done, at best, because, hey, you're in a black metal band. I doubt that every member of every black metal band wants to express the same emotions and thoughts and nobody outside the genre wants to express anything similar. At this point, a defense of their freedom of expression is irrelevent, since they aren't exercising it. Then it is as stupid as it looks.

It's true that image doesn't matter; it's the music that's important. Then, why go to such lengths to cultivate the image? If they feel that these pictures help to fill out what they're trying to get at with their music, it's right to take that into consideration. If they don't, they're spending way too much time dressing up and posing. Anyway, I don't like the music; if I did, I'd do my best to ignore how stupid they look.

Virtually every genre starts out small, misunderstood, and without any concern for what other people think, and I know you know this. I'm not sure what your point is with that, if you had one.
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  #35  
Old 2004-11-02, 07:33
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wat about the whole blood drinking/spitting thing
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  #36  
Old 2004-11-02, 11:52
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i dont hink corpse paint is silly, hell, if done right, it can look pretty fuckin cool, but corpse paint isnt a strictly black metal thing, to prove my point i bring out exhibit A, well its my only exhibit at the moment, but i think its pretty fucking good. The black dahlia murder are thrashy death metal, and they on occasion where corpse paint.
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  #37  
Old 2004-11-02, 15:44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoonRaven
i dont hink corpse paint is silly, hell, if done right, it can look pretty fuckin cool, but corpse paint isnt a strictly black metal thing, to prove my point i bring out exhibit A, well its my only exhibit at the moment, but i think its pretty fucking good. The black dahlia murder are thrashy death metal, and they on occasion where corpse paint.
Yeah, I remember seeing them at one point with corpse paint. I was like the fuck?
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  #38  
Old 2004-11-02, 15:59
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Corpsepaint was cool when it was first used,now it's just another
cliche
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  #39  
Old 2004-11-02, 16:17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Transient
wow....who cares? i dont know about you guys, but when i hear a bands cd i dont see the makeup

tru dat
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  #40  
Old 2004-11-02, 18:35
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To CtD - I didn't defend freedom of expression, I defended freedom to do whatever the fuck you want to do, even if you're not expressing an origional thought. Just because everybody else does it, it doesn't mean that you can't do it if you genuinely like it. I genuinely like to dress like a completely ordinary person at times, but everybody dresses like that. Does that mean I stop dressing like that to make a statement?
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