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-   -   RIAA Legal Ruling Could Shut Down The Internet (http://metaltabs.com/forum/showthread.php?t=34222)

AchromaticChronicles 2006-11-29 20:08

RIAA Legal Ruling Could Shut Down The Internet
 
http://prisonplanet.com/articles/no...106shutdown.htm

"U.S. government supports legal case that would criminalize making any files available on the world wide web"

Yes, I'd agree that the title is, or sounds, sensationalistic (in that it's doubtful this will 'shut down' the internet), but it is still an interesting bit of news that should be looked into, especially because this indeed could push the 'Internet 2' agenda further ahead. I thought that this should make for a good discussion, and that its fairly relevant.

It also might help to read this as well: http://www.defectivebydesign.org/node/404

This, too: Spanish judge rules file sharing legal http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/1...nloading_legal/

And if you're not too bored already, this: A look at the RIAA'S actions towards its own consumers http://www.progressiveu.org/190000-...s-own-consumers

Draw your own conclusions.

"If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable" - Louis D. Brandeis

Remember: 'When you pirate mp3's, you're downloading communism!' (or if you prefer a different, more modern term, terrorism).

tmfreak 2006-11-29 20:43

So are you for or against downloading mp3s and so on and so on?

Dyvim Tvar 2006-11-29 21:11

as for mp3 downloading, for me, I download albums, if they're decent I buy them, I'm not a total cunt, I want to support the bands, I'll buy the cds, t-shirts etc, but I think downloading the albums beforehand is a nice way of finding out wether you like the band or not rather than listening to ashitty 10 second clip of just going into a record store and buying something you later dont' want.

Ten Ton Alien 2006-11-29 21:29

holy shit, can you imagine all the faggotnerds mySpace/Messenger/IRC/etc users coming out of their basements and try to have an actual social life under direct exposure of sunlight?

i'll headbutt the first who says "LOL" during a conversation.

AchromaticChronicles 2006-11-29 21:45

Sure, why not, I'm for many aspects of file sharing.

File sharing was how I first dicovered a lot of the music I listen to now, and if it weren't for it I wouldn't have found death metal as readily as I did then (back in like 2000/2001). Also, as a spinoff of that I'm fairly certain I wouldn't have picked up a guitar if it weren't for an interest in the music that I found via filesharing. One of the first was Iniquity, then Nile etc. I don't download music that often anymore, unless its to preview an new album or whatever, because now I own a large portion of the music I downloaded in the past (although I have like 2100 songs on my ipod, some cd's some shit I haven't been able to buy).

So even though I download shit, most of it is stuff I plan to buy or want to buy; for instance I have songs by sleep terror right now that were downloaded, but I intend on (as soon as I find a place I can buy Sleept Terror at) buying sleep terror's albums, because they are a good band and I do want to support such acts (also by buying shirts, etc which I do as well). It makes sense to me, previewing music before hand. Also, buying the cd makes me feel a little better as the I have a tangible object to point to. I have a list of albums I need to get but can't find at the moment, so I still use mp3s I've downloaded. I'm sure this isn't a foreign concept to people here; at least I hope. Also being strapped for cash sometimes doesn't help; + cd's are over priced, especially metal cds which are usually $22.95 cnd instead of say a mainstream artist's album which is like $11.95 to $15.00, due to the low demand for large amounts of metal cd's I asume.

It's the same for comedy series in .avi or .mpg. For ATHF (Aqua Teen Hunger Force), I wanted to watch a lot of the episodes without having to wait till friday every week, so I downloaded most of the episodes, and ended up really liking the show. Eventually I went out and bought all 4 volumes of ATHF, and I dont regret it. Same thing for Harvey Birdman, when the new season is released on dvd I'll buy it, because before hand I've downloaded almost all of the second season epidsodes. I may not do this for EVERYTHING I download, but a significant section of what I download I eventually buy.

Ofcourse it depends on the music you download, I think. If you're only downloading mainstream, cookie cutter 'artists' that make a fair amount of money through means other than just cds (like their clothing lines, posters, maybe even dolls), then I don't see a huge loss to the 'artist', especially because most of the people downloading that shit most likely do go out and buy it anyway. If its something that may take some actualy talent, say death metal or other forms of metal, or hell even classical music, than it may be more harmful to those artists than the mainstream. But I'm pretty sure most underground artists don't have a big problem with file sharing, as they know how useful it can be, especially to reacha broader audience (although I have no concrete examples come to mind at the moment).

Just to clarify, I'm against the 'Internet 2' agenda that the article points to.

DeathCS 2006-11-29 22:04

Government regulated internet?
I will not stand for this.
"Internet 2 - a completely controlled, surveilled and autocratic cyber police state similar to the Chinese model, whereby website owners have to obtain government permission to run a blog, be approved by a biometric thumb scan just to turn their computer on, and immediately get their Internet access shut off if they misbehave."
I don't know the validity of this but I don't doubt it at all.
Better not commit any thought crimes.

AchromaticChronicles 2006-11-29 22:13

Check out Alex Jone's/ Paul Watson's discussion of the above article(s) on his radio program now, here (recently added to the site): http://prisonplanet.tv/audio/291106watson.mp3

Also, recently Newt Gingrich has made statements about 'rethinking' the first amendment of the bill of rights ( details here: http://kurtnimmo.com/?p=681 ), talking about limiting free speech on the internet to stop terrorists spreading there views. Keith Olbermann's dicussion with constitutional law expert Jonathan Turley has some fair questions about Newt's comments: "When you talk about closing down internet sites, who is the one who is going to decide which those are?"

http://www.corvuswire.com/olbermann-clg.htm

BrokenCrimson 2006-11-29 23:10

Limit to freedom! LIMIT TO FREEDOM!

CompelledToLacerate 2006-11-30 00:04

Wouldn't affect me much since I don't download mp3's.

In my opinion, this whole issue with file sharing is ridiculous. Yeah, it's evil and corrupt the way the RIAA is suing people for downloading songs through file sharing, but it's not the end of the world.

And one question. Call me an idiot if it's needed, but last time I checked, if you buy an item, keep the receipt, and are unsatisfied, you could return it for either store credit or your own money. So the only thing you'd be wasting buying a cd you don't like is the time it took to get up off your ass (excuse the bluntness), go to the store, and get the cd.

low-tech 2006-11-30 00:17

alex jones is a 9/11 conspiracy theory hack and prison planet sucks. the guy is seriously fucking up leftwing politics with his prophecy/nutcase bullshit.

as for the topic,i dont think they could even if they want to, the music industry is dying and the internet goes way beyond the borders of the US.

AaronDonahue 2006-11-30 00:47

A more potent threat to the internet comes from the U.S.A. trying to exert control under the guise of stopping online child pornography/exploitation. This is ridiculous as the internet is instrumental in revealing these types of people. Remember Justin Berry? As if he wasn't being exploited by certain organizations...


And yeah, Gingrich is wonderful. He talks about limiting free speech at a fucking awards ceremony celebrating it.
mms://youngturks.vo.llnwd.net/o1/11-29Newt.wmv

tmfreak 2006-11-30 01:12

Quote:
Originally Posted by CompelledToLacerate
Wouldn't affect me much since I don't download mp3's.

In my opinion, this whole issue with file sharing is ridiculous. Yeah, it's evil and corrupt the way the RIAA is suing people for downloading songs through file sharing, but it's not the end of the world.

And one question. Call me an idiot if it's needed, but last time I checked, if you buy an item, keep the receipt, and are unsatisfied, you could return it for either store credit or your own money. So the only thing you'd be wasting buying a cd you don't like is the time it took to get up off your ass (excuse the bluntness), go to the store, and get the cd.


Its alot more complicated than you and others make it seem.

I don't PLAN on getting too involved into this topic, but to simply regard file sharing over the internet as.. nothing but something negative, would literally be telling almost every fucking band you listen to, to go fuck off. Seriously. I would venture to say THOUSANDS of bands have flourish and EXIST as a result of the internet and file swapping.

Its a known fucking fact artists don't make their money on cds. Thats a fact. I've read it again and again and again. They make off of merchandise at shows and through their own stores. To sit here and say "i'm so righteous because i actually bought the cd" well i say you can go fuck yourself (not so much attacking you CTL, but just saying it in general).

There has been a BEYOND bigger impact to the music scene (especially as WE all know it, NOT pop stars and FAMOUS people) as a result of file sharing. The only reason this is even a fucking topic is because of greedy ass whiney bastards like Metallica and the RIAA want to manipulate and twist the facts to suit them.

Side tangent from purely music but onto the aspect of video games and applications. I've been downloading warez for over 10 years now. Over 10 fucking years. I've seen the entire thing progress from random websites to what it is today. To say that these companies are LOSING money as a result of American piracy is complete and total bullshit. Sure they might lose "SOME" profit as a result of somebody not buying. But they would like to twist the facts just like the RIAA in order for them to seem like the poor and defenseless. Now there is a HUGE difference between your standard american or swedish piracy and..... Chinese piracy. Piracy in china is RIDICULOUS. First of all there is substational markets for selling the merchandise. That highly leads to lose profits, because it creates it brings the same product to the consumer at cheaper prices. As with american piracy its not brought to the consumer and sometimes is hella annoying to get.

Also Back on what i was going to say about false lost profits. Its almost painfully obvious to see that just because somebody downloads something doesn't mean that they were going to buy then now or ever, yet they still constitute as "money taken." Thats just twisting the reality to suit their most desired needs. To honestly sit here and say that the current system of consumer/producer buying software is just fine and dandy, is completely and total bullshit. Its just the same thing as everything else. It needs progression. What i mean by this is for instance i watched some CHEESY ASS anti-piracy video from 1992 or somethin earlier today and it pissed me off, because it said.. that (in mid RAP.. ha..) something like buying a game tells the maker you want more.

What if i bring it home and its just horrible? Fuck them. I dont' want them to make more, or even approve of it. Its the kind of relationship where they put stuff out and you take chances on it. They put it at high fucking prices that its not worth taking "chances" with.


Annnnnyways. let me step off my rant horse.. ha.
In short. For much more things than i've said here, (i've only scratched the basic surface) file sharing, and piracy effects have (in my opinion) done much more and continue to do much more good than negatives.

tmfreak 2006-11-30 01:14

Quote:
Originally Posted by AaronDonahue
A more potent threat to the internet comes from the U.S.A. trying to exert control under the guise of stopping online child pornography/exploitation. This is ridiculous as the internet is instrumental in revealing these types of people. Remember Justin Berry? As if he wasn't being exploited by certain organizations...


And yeah, Gingrich is wonderful. He talks about limiting free speech at a fucking awards ceremony celebrating it.
mms://youngturks.vo.llnwd.net/o1/11-29Newt.wmv


You're about half right. Although you do make a very good and solid point about revealing the shit bags in society. The internet is a good but dangerous tool for this.

BassBehemoth 2006-11-30 01:40

There has been so many threads on this..and all of them are closed.

I sold the Pokemon rom(w/emulator) to kids at my school when it came out. :cool:

$2 well worth it, they supplied the blank floppy.

tmfreak 2006-11-30 01:42

Quote:
Originally Posted by BassBehemoth
There has been so many threads on this..and all of them are closed.

I sold the Pokemon rom(w/emulator) to kids at my school when it came out. :cool:

$2 well worth it, they supplied the blank floppy.


Yeah i know right (about threads)

And.. coming from a pro-piracy person.... you fucker!

CompelledToLacerate 2006-11-30 02:09

Quote:
Originally Posted by tmfreak
Its alot more complicated than you and others make it seem.

I don't PLAN on getting too involved into this topic, but to simply regard file sharing over the internet as.. nothing but something negative, would literally be telling almost every fucking band you listen to, to go fuck off. Seriously. I would venture to say THOUSANDS of bands have flourish and EXIST as a result of the internet and file swapping.

Its a known fucking fact artists don't make their money on cds. Thats a fact. I've read it again and again and again. They make off of merchandise at shows and through their own stores. To sit here and say "i'm so righteous because i actually bought the cd" well i say you can go fuck yourself (not so much attacking you CTL, but just saying it in general).

I guess I didn't see it like that. You have a good point.

And I agree about the whole "righteous" thing most people have. The biggest reason I'd say I prefer to buy the cd's as opposed to file sharing or even burning them off of a friend (I have done it before, and some of them don't come out right) is.... as far as musical quality, how good the music is, you may not know, but you are more than likely guarenteed that it will actually work. With file sharing, you may end up getting a shitload of spyware programs along with whatever you intended to get. KAZAA, which I mainly used to download anime music videos and not actual songs, completely destroyed our old computer . You can't open so much as a folder without it freezing on you. And with burning CD's from friends, you don't know if it will come out right. My Metallica S&M album was burnt off of a friend, and his copy of the second disc was so scratched up that half the songs skip or won't play.

johnmansley 2006-11-30 04:17

Quote:
Originally Posted by CompelledToLacerate
And one question. Call me an idiot if it's needed, but last time I checked, if you buy an item, keep the receipt, and are unsatisfied, you could return it for either store credit or your own money. So the only thing you'd be wasting buying a cd you don't like is the time it took to get up off your ass (excuse the bluntness), go to the store, and get the cd.


Fucking right.

Tmfreak: Artists do make money from albums: the record deal advance they receive is basically cash for future sales of their albums. The record company claw some of it back by taking a larger cut of the ensuing royalties in the early stages of an album's release to guard against poor sales and not breaking even. Once the break even point is met, the royalties then begin to flow to the band (less the label's cut, of course).

But you are correct in saying that the money that generally sustains a band derives from merchandise bought at shows - although most bands struggle to break even from tours once sustenance and essentials are paid for.

Ten Ton Alien 2006-11-30 06:07

Quote:
Originally Posted by BassBehemoth
There has been so many threads on this..and all of them are closed.

I sold the Pokemon rom(w/emulator) to kids at my school when it came out. :cool:

$2 well worth it, they supplied the blank floppy.


i used to sell porno filled CD's for $5. actually bought a PS2 with the money i made.

USS 2006-11-30 06:33

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ten Ton Alien
i used to sell porno filled CD's for $5. actually bought a PS2 with the money i made.

So now you can watch what you have been making? :p
A great job anyway;).

tmfreak 2006-11-30 08:53

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnmansley
Fucking right.

Tmfreak: Artists do make money from albums: the record deal advance they receive is basically cash for future sales of their albums. The record company claw some of it back by taking a larger cut of the ensuing royalties in the early stages of an album's release to guard against poor sales and not breaking even. Once the break even point is met, the royalties then begin to flow to the band (less the label's cut, of course).

But you are correct in saying that the money that generally sustains a band derives from merchandise bought at shows - although most bands struggle to break even from tours once sustenance and essentials are paid for.


I should have been slightly clearer. Sure they make "money" but generally its enough to substain cd production.

And to CTL. Other than the fact that thats not neccesarily the case anymore you're still right. Its part of the way it goes. If you want to attempt to go through the wickens to download a game, be prepared for the side effects that could happen as a result, especially if you have no idea what you're doing. And personally to me if you don't know what you're doing.. stay the hell off a computer. k? :p
I don't want to teach your dumbass how to attach to emails.


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